Arise, arise, riders of Théoden Tyrion!
We’re not quite at the big battle for Winterfell, but we are one very full hour away from it beginning. How would you spend your last night in Westeros? Some people like a warm fire, good wine, and better conversation. Some people choose to do something even more life-affirming.
And some people are not people, but Bran.
Squick-inducing spoilers after the cut. Be aware that book spoilers are allowed, but we are so far beyond Martin territory now, you’ll probably be fine on that front.
I kinda love that next week’s episode is likely going to be one giant battle sequence, so we get a lot of time dedicated to the characters actually talking. It builds suspense for next week and it makes me even more curious and invested in who will survive.
I have no doubt some of these characters won’t get to talk to one another again. But it was enjoyable to reflect on how much these people have changed since the show began.
We started off right away with Jaime and I’m glad we got it over with fast. Not that it wasn’t interesting, but viewers (and readers) have long come around to Team Jaime, even though he’s done bad things—even more in the show than the book. This storyline is taken at just the right, believable pace for me. I’m glad we reestablished Brienne’s respect for Jaime, and Sansa’s trust of Brienne, too.
Tyrion and Jaime seem pretty bemused by their impending death in Winterfell, of all places. I love their conversations so much.
I was really excited to think for a few minutes that Sansa and Dany would stop acting like Real Housewives of Winterfell, but, alas. “What about the North?” indeed. This is where I diverge from Dany. I love her. I think she’s earned the Iron Throne because she has the best interests of the most people in mind. And while some people think she’s too much of a dictator, a conqueror, perhaps mad, I see an unapologetic leader who has worked really fucking hard and earned all of her myriad titles. And were she a man, more people would certainly go easier on her.
But the North should be the North.
We’ve been seeing the war from their side for so long, how can we not view them a bit differently than the South? They are the first line of defense, they are rebuilding after great betrayals. I think they’re owed their independence. But from Dany’s perspective, I can see that not making sense. It’s a tough situation, but the lack of a clear resolution kinda makes me wonder/hope that Dany will rule in the south and her husband, who I will never call Aegon, can keep on being King of the North. Long-distance relationships are a lot easier when you’ve both got your own private dragon jets.
But with Jon revealing his trueborn name, Dany’s looking real glad she didn’t book a DJ for their wedding just yet.
My main squick was obviously Arya and Gendry’s desperate, sudden shag. I’m not quite opposed to this, in theory, I guess. Arya is eighteen, thankfully, which probably puts her as older than most married girls in Westeros. But it does feel strange to see her with this heretofore unmentioned burning curiosity about sex before she dies. It just seemed kinda random.
And is Gendry getting creeping lessons from Bran? Why was he watching Arya from the shadows like a weirdo? That made the tone seem off from the start. Gendry didn’t seem too into it. I would’ve liked more chemistry in a pairing people have been shipping for a while. Meh.
I still like it more than Sansa and Theon. *shudders* I never thought Sansa could miss Theon so much. I never thought anyone could miss Theon so much, period.
I like it less than Tormund and Brienne.
I thought for sure if anyone was going to spend their final night on earth getting sweaty, it would be the two of them. I felt like Brienne has a Sansa-like heart and once daydreamed of romance, but talked herself out of it because people treated her so shittily. Everyone should see how beautiful Brienne is, inside and out! Tormund wants her physically, but I think Jaime could love her more wholly. Brienne of course doesn’t need to be paired with anyone, but it’d just be an interesting new experience for her to navigate without a sword.
But, her sword will help her a lot more than Tormund’s, ahem… yeah… in the hours ahead.
Please, please don’t kill Brienne right after she gets her knighthood. Or Dolorous Edd when he finally gets some lines. Or Grey Worm and Missandei before they travel to the warm, sandy beaches of Naath.
Game of Thrones doesn’t really have to be synonymous with death, right?
Unlike Arya, this is one face I don’t want to see. Not today. Or ever.
Final thoughts:
- “Someone taller.” I DIE OF LAUGHTER. Our Queen is hilarious.
- GHOST!
- Gwendoline Christie really did a standout job tonight. Between Jaime’s “trial,” Brienne’s knighthood, and her… complex feelings for Tormund, she played a wide variety of emotions with deft skill.
- Sorry to kill any romance, but who else was age-appropriate for Arya to lose her virginity to? Hot Pie, that’s who.
- Bran as bait is…well, he’s literally a plot McGuffin now. Like, he may as well be an inanimate object, given that Bran’s not really doing much in terms of action just yet. I think the Three-Eyed Raven’s going to have to be the key to bringing down the Night King. Brute force will never be enough. There has to be some magic.
- Jorah was pretty chill this week. I liked him defending Tyrion, accepting Samwell’s gifted sword, and getting dressed down by little badass Lyanna Mormont. I feel like he’s pretty doomed.
- Wouldn’t Sansa make a good hand of the Queen? Just saying, if Tyrion and Mormont die…
- Oh, Ser Davos and your little Shireen stand-in. Broke my heart. It feels like everyone’s getting getting their last words in!
- That said, Varys was awful quiet this episode.
- Next week: The Battle of
Helm’s DeepWinterfell.
Theresa DeLucci is a regular contributor to Tor.com covering TV, book reviews and sometimes games. She’s also gotten enthusiastic about television for Boing Boing, Wired.com’s Geek’s Guide to the Galaxy podcast and Den of Geek. Send her a raven via Twitter.
Count me as someone who’s never been on Team Jaime and still isn’t. Still, they made the right call to keep him alive for the battle. Same with Theon.
Once again I find myself doubting Sansa’s judgment. They’re about to face an apocalyptic battle with the dead and she breaks up a conversation in which Dany tried very hard to make nice with a purely hypothetical question about the North after the War is over.
I see lots of discussion about the Arya/Gendry (Gendrya?) scene. I didn’t have a problem with it. The character is 18, the actress is 21 (and it wasn’t Maisie anyway).
I loved the way Jon told Dany about his parents.
The Arya-Gendry thing surprised me, but worked for me as a sign that she is reengaging with humanity instead of being a faceless killing machine.
Bran’s “The things we do for love” line and Jaime’s shocked reaction slayed me.
Sansa-Theon also worked for me. He saved her from a life of hell with Ramsey Bolton and they trusted each other to jump off a wall together. Nice call back.
Loved the Jenny of Oldstones song and what its inclusion suggests for the plot going forward.
I’ve seen a lot of criticism of the episode online, but I loved it – I tend to find big battle set pieces extremely dull after the first 5 minutes (that includes episodes like Hardhome and Battle of the Blackwater, etc) and I know at least one of the episodes is going to be like that (probably the next one) so I LOVE that we got an episode dedicated to character development and dialogue and character study. That’s what gives all the battle scenes meaning, imo. I don’t just want to see a bunch of people hacking at each other and dying in various gory/shocking ways.
I have to admit, I’m mostly on Team Sansa here – I agree that (like Jon’s big bombshell) there was probably a more diplomatic time and place to bring it up (especially given that a bunch of people will probably be dead soon so the drama might end up resolving itself!) but I think it would suit Dany well to make a compromise here. And I kind of like that Sansa wasn’t taken in by her “oh, look at us, we’re strong women, amirite!” when really she was just trying to use it as an excuse to assert her dominance. Eff that. I’m not totally anti-Dany and agree that she’s put in the work, but I thinks he’s got a lot ot learn about statecraft still.
Theon groan. As soon as there was that big hug, I KNEW you were going to rag on it, and said as much to my husband lol. Both my husband and I had huge eye rolls to that scene. It’s weird how I’m more or less on board for the Jaime redemption, but not Theon’s. I admit, he’s slowly warming to me since he does seem to at least be acknowledging his wrongs, but I’ll never forget the millers boys. So there. (That said, I do get why, with their shared trauma, Sansa and Theon will have that connection, whether or not its logical.)
Brienne and Pod are my favorite. Who knew Pod could sing? And I definitely got a LotR vibe to that – the song definitely starts out in the same fashion as Pippin’s song.
As for Arya’s scene -I’m not sure if this was intentional, but I got a very akward feel from it. Like she was TRYING to act like a ‘normal’ human being, trying to grasp at some semblance of connection (and I do think there was SOME spark with her and Gendry that had been established throughout the show) but she’s lost so much of her humanity it didn’t quite land. Her in depth probing of Gendry’s past sex life was super awkward, as was her cut to the chase. Like…she was just trying to check off some box of ‘human experience’. But I think that might have been intentional, honestly.
Did Sam end up deciding to stay in the crypt? Or was he just there for the night? I didn’t quite get the implication there. I mean, I know he gave his sword to Jorah, but wasn’t sure if that meant he had decided to stay out of the battle entirely.
All that said, given that they stayed ‘the crypt is safe!!!’ about five million times means that we know it’s decidedly NOT safe (and full of dead people, thanks internet for pointing that out) so his presence may in fact be needed/important there. I’m wondering of the Stark crypt will end up being important in some magical way.
I have to admit the couple I was rooting for was Arya and Hot Pie. Call me a romantic, but I really hoped they would get together.
Sigh!
Guy
The show did lay the groundwork for Arya and Gendry with their flirty conversations earlier in the series (and with all the talk of the crypts and that scene there with Jon and Dany, it is a callback to Robert telling Ned in the crypts that there houses should be joined). It was the execution that was lacking. It was too much I’m-a-woman-now-so-I-must-immediately-have-sex-but-without-joy and not nearly enough we’ve-got-this-sexual-tension-and-will-probably-die-tomorrow-so-tonight-let’s-live.
I did appreciate that Arya told him to take his pants off. Based on past Game of Thrones sex scenes, I am assuming that Pod’s trick is “takes off his pants first.”
The Sansa and Dany scene is the first one where I believe Sansa is playing smart, instead of undermining their purpose by insulting Dany openly in front of all their subordinates.
I had been expecting Arya and Gendry to get together since season 2 scene when he found out she was a girl. And she had been eyeing him like a direwolf eyes a wounded stag. I was more expecting the showrunners to imply Arya’s undress even if it was a body double for the more risque shots. In a generation removed sense, Robert finally got with Lyanna.
The crypts may be the safest place in Winterfell, if the attacking force is not holding Animate Dead spells.
Speaking of Helm’s Deep, when Tyrion and Jaimie were looking out over the training ground from the castle wall, I was reminded of this scene:
It just seemed kinda random.
I mean the desire for sex and the desire to live have always been intertwined, narratively speaking, and Arya’s the one character who’s gone the furthest away from her desire to live, and had the furthest to come back, and demonstrating a desire for sex is a neat way to handle that. Having that seen immediately follow Arya recognizing she doesn’t want anything more in common with Sandor and Beric, who once belonged on her list, seems the opposite of random.
Arya has evolved AWAY from the Faceless Man, away from the scared little girl who could only see vengeance in front of her. This moment with Gendry was the culmination of that growth.
But yes, still totally weird, having a sex scene with girl I saw as a child.
Sansa and Dany was great.
Tormund’s absurd flex on Jaime was the best. I laughed so hard. That whole scene before the fire.
I like the way they had Job tell Dany, by breaking the myth of Rhaegar and Lyanna, a story that Dany has always struggled with in building her conception of Rhaegar, who never sounded like the person who could do what what we’d been told he’d done.
Still pretty sure Bran’s gonna Warg that Wight Dragon.
I actually liked the Sansa-Dany scene. Sansa could have just given her happy talk, after the girl to girl apology for being a bit of a bitch during the introduction, but she stuck with the honesty theme and put her actual big picture concern squarely on the table. It didn’t get resolved (due to the Theon entrance) but it might help lay the groundwork for a future resolution.
@1 – I haven’t seen anything in the post-episode articles suggesting that it was not Maisie. She just turned 22 IRL and it was a pretty modest reveal in any event.
And yeah, they are definitely setting up something to happen in the crypts. Though wouldn’t it be funny if they were mostly empty, because the North remembers and burns their dead??
@9, The biggest problem for Dany’s character right now in regards to the North, is that she’s “put in the work” for the rest of the kingdoms, and hasn’t for the North, but still expects them to “bend the knee”.
All the scenes between Jaime and Brienne were magnificent. From the Trial, to the sword training, to the knighting. And the look of utmost pride on Brienne’s face as he named her a Knight of the Seven Kingdoms was perfect.
Agree with Sophist that Sansa kind of screeched the conversation with Dany to a halt in a way that was unnecessary to the conversation at hand. And Dany’s reaction to Jon’s news was pretty much exactly what I expected it to be, and I said as much on these boards after the Season 7 finale.
Like most people who watch the show, I’ve been giving a lot of thought to who will live and die when all is said and done. Obviously, I’m far too sensible to have any strong expectations that any specific individuals will LIVE at the end of the series. But my list of (generally heroic, because too hell with Cersei, Euron, and the Mountain) characters who I would be willing to bet money will DIE before the series is over currently sits at Jaime, Theon, and Jorah. Mostly because I can see the narrative threads that result in their redemptions through death.
The real question I have now is…what will the Beautiful Death blog feature for this week????
It will either have to be something thematic, or maybe a reference to those that were lost on the way to Winterfell from the Night’s Watch/Last Hearth. Is this the only episode that hasn’t had an onscreen death?
@8 – ah, yes, I didn’t quite make the connection with the scene between that and her deciding not to sit up with the ‘miserable old shits’. I think it was a well done/complicated scene – in that she was genuinely seeking that connection, but still not able to really do it perfectly (and even in the end montage she seemed a bit…distant).
The interesting thing about Rhaegar + Lyanna is that while we do know they were genuinely in love and Lyanna was a willing member of the relationship, history is certainly full of men who seemed generous, kind, etc and even maybe “loved” somebody…but were still rapists. I was kind of wishing Jon would have emphasized that Lyanna went with him freely. (And maybe also that he himself only JUST found out about it, and it’s not like he was trying to keep a big secret from her the whole time.)
@11: How has Dany not “put in the work” for the North? She’s literally risking her entire army p, and her dragon-children, to save them from an army of ice zombies, while another woman sits on the Iron Throne.
Would Sansa prefer that the North was an independent kningdom facing the White Walkers with the handful if men they had left, while Dany stayed in the south and won the other six kingdoms from Cersei? Of does she think it’s merely to be expected that Dany sacrifice everything she’s built and risk her own life to save the North, and then leave as if she were owned nothing for it? I’m sympathetic to the North’s desire for independence, but a reasonable person can’t simultaneously demand massive military aid from a kindom they’re seceding from.
@8: I like the way you read Arya’s Hound and Gendry scenes.
@9: It looked cgi’d to me at the, uh, critical moment, and that seems to be the consensus on line. I should phrase it less definitively though, so part of it may have been cgi/body double.
Did anyone else notice Arya’s eyes light up when she heard Gendry mention he is Roberts bastard? She seemed to rush him to bed after that. That does give him some claim to the crown. Maybe Arya wanted to get his baby in her to proclaim a northern title to the throne? If enough people are alive after the big bad battle that is lol! Another thought. Doesn’t it seem like they could use a boat load (pun intended) of wildfire around now? Sure would burn a heap of ice zombies if the dragons run low. Maybe Cercie’s plan for kings Landing. Otherwise loved the scene with Briananne’s knighting. Well deserved, and I don’t think I’ve even seen a true smile on her face. Good stuff!
Maisie Williams comments on the scene make it sound like it was all her and not cgi or a body double (for what it’s worth):
https://ew.com/tv/2019/04/21/game-of-thrones-maisie-williams-gendry/
@14: I agree with what you said. Dany has overcome insurmountable events that has led her to where she is today; then falling in love with Jon has derailed that by going to the North to fight alongside! I wish Northerners could see this, could appreciate this, Sansa especially!! Maybe after she helps defeat the night king, they will see her for who she is. She does seem to not have any allies now in Winterfell but I’m hoping that will change. I hope they Jon and Dany survive; Jon relinquish is claim; but serve as Hand of the Queen or Kingsguard.
@8: Bran is so going to warg the ice dragon!
@17: Interesting; looks like I was wrong. Thanks.
Switching topics, I want to add that I will be REALLY disappointed if at some point one character doesn’t turn to another and say “I’ve always wanted to slay a dragon.”
@6 – The crypts may be the safest place in Winterfell, if the attacking force is not holding Animate Dead spells.
Agreed. I spent the whole hour confused about this plan to hide in the crypts. When did they open all those graves and burn the bones? Or did they seal the individual crypts shut so the dead can’t get out when the Night King calls them up? This doesn’t make any sense, especially if Jon Snow signed off on the plan.
Brienne’s induction is one of the best scenes the series has ever done.
@14 How has Dany not “put in the work” for the North? She’s literally risking her entire army p, and her dragon-children, to save them from an army of ice zombies, while another woman sits on the Iron Throne.
Has she talked to any one them? Any of the Stark Bannermen? The Southern Lords allied with Dany, after she used diplomacy and shared animosity towards Cersei, and their people fall in line. That’s not the North though. Right now she’s talked a good game, but they need to see her doing it. All she’s done now invade, and remove Jon from his throne. Made her martial support conditional on his abandonment of his throne. How they feel about her will likely change after the battle, as it did towards Jon once he defeated Ramsay.
None of those things were designed to be diplomatic in regards to the North, so why is she surprised when they reject her diplomacy.
“Someone taller.”
I cried a little. :-D
Also, Brienne’s face ANY time Tormund talks, and HIS face when he thinks of her… “Is the Big Woman here?” Plus the whole “giant milk” thing. SO glad they have that humor in here. Personally I think it’d be great to see Brienne with him AND Jaime. They’d make a great triad.
@15 Sophist,
This is one of the few things you and I have ever disagreed on, but why exactly are you so opposed to Jaime’s redemption arc?
I view Jaime, almost more than any other character who has agency, as one of the largest victims. I mean, he and Cersei’s relationship began at a time when people are at their most toxic in regards to interpersonal relationships. What they had between one another was horrific, but he didn’t have any true agency in starting it, and no one who did intervened to stop it, which is what needed to happen.
Jaime is at the end of the day, the way he is because of other’s failures. Tywin’s failure as a parent, only viewing his children as tools to exert his will on the realm. The Kingsguard’s failure to do something about the Mad King before Jaime was left to do what he did. More has been done to Jaime, to make him the man he was when he’s introduced, than he is there because of his own choices.
Now, my “redemption for Jaime” only goes so far. The narrative should absolutely not reward him in any way. He shouldn’t get a “happy ever after”, because being redeemed doesn’t mean he shouldn’t be held accountable. He shouldn’t get to be Kingsguard of the new ruler. But I definitely think is redemption is one of the better ones ever scripted.
Aeryl: My view of Jaime comes down basically to 2 points:
1. Pushing Bran out the window. That’s pretty much an unforgiveable act for me. As you know, I have kids and I’m pretty sensitive on this point. It was as callous and cruel an act as I can imagine short of someone like, say, Ramsay or Joffrey. It wasn’t Jaime’s only flaw either — he says he would have cut off Arya’s hand if he had caught her after the incident on the Trident; he attacked Ned and killed Rory — but it’s the real sticking point for me.
2. I don’t see him as having done actual good deeds since. He does get credit for the bear pit and for passing the torch to Brienne regarding his oath to Catelyn. He also stops being as arrogant and heedless as he was in S1. But that just meant that he continued on a bad path — allied with Cersei — for 7 full seasons albeit with less cruelty (sure it was less cruel to offer poison to Oleanna than to turn her over to Cersei, but she was just as dead). The first time he ever took a step towards redemption, IMO, was when he headed to Winterfell.
That doesn’t mean I think him irredeemable. It’s just that I think he’s far from there yet.
Damn. There was supposed to be a “many” before “good deeds”. Also, I left out the defense of Brienne from rape.
@20: I’ve been thinking about this and I’ve got a theory. No spoiler, pure speculation.
In the books, it’s implied that the iron swords across the laps of the statues are in some way protective. It’s unclear what or why. There’s also the saying that “there must always be a Stark in Winterfell”. I’m wondering if raising the dead from the crypts will boomerang on the WW by enabling one of the Starks to control their own dead and fight the WW.
I don’t disagree with either of those. I agree that Jaime’s “redemption arc” doesn’t actually get started until he finally abandons Cersei, which is why it’s fitting his first act is to show up in Winterfell, and to be held accountable for what he’s done, especially to Bran.
The things we’re shown about Jaime’s character prior to this though, isn’t because he’s on a redemption arc, it’s to show us, and him, that he is not who the world perceives him to be. It was to get us all in the headspace where we would see Jaime as a man worthy of being redeemed, and it seems like the show has failed in that regard for you.
I mean, aside from throwing Bran, which IS terrible, every one of those things was done by Jaime trying to do what the person he’s perceived to be would do. It’s also why it’s interesting, that when we see Jaime and Tywin’s first interaction, it’s literally Jaime trying to get out of doing what he is obligated to do as a Lannister, something he’s apparently always done.
Jaime is literally one of the few people who have privilege in Westeros, who pushes against that privilege. It’s also this pressure, that makes his relationship with Cersei make a lot more sense. Cersei loved Jaime because she’s a narcissist and he reflected back at her, who she wished she could be. But Jaime loved Cersei because she was the one person who didn’t push him to be other than he was, and their separations from one another have always come when Cersei betrayed that sensibility, and pushed Jaime to act in ways he didn’t want.
And as far as Bran goes, it is terrible, but Robert mercilessly beheading Joffrey, Tommen and Myrcella would have been as well. When Ned doctored Robert’s will, that act was him trying to murder Joffrey as surely as Jaime tried to murder Bran, why do we as an audience take Ned’s side though? Joffrey, terrible as he was, was innocent of his mother and father’s actions in conceiving him.
If we as an audience are supposed to unequivocally condemn Jaime, why aren’t we expected to do so to others, whose actions have the same impact?
Yeah, I’d say it has to date. That could change with the events of this season.
> The Arya-Gendry thing surprised me, but worked for me as a sign that she is reengaging with humanity instead of being a faceless killing machine.
@2 Exactly, well said.
I still don’t comprehend the huge hug Sansa gave Theon — WHAT?!
Here’s hoping the major heroes make it out alive from the battle next week. After that the battle will be with the Gold Company?
Right on — great DeLucci recap and wonderful comments by everyone.
@28, I edited my comment to contain some more rambling
@29, Theon has done precious little good in this series. Sansa has had so little good done for her.
Beheading Joffrey wouldn’t have been so bad. :) Sure, and if Robert had done that, as seems likely, I’d judge him pretty harshly too. But Jaime was the one who created the problem, so I don’t think he gets any pass on harming Bran to try to escape it. Sacrificing himself would have been noble. Sacrificing Cersei would have been just. Sacrificing an innocent child to save the guilty parties doesn’t impress me.
I also don’t think Ned was trying to murder Joffrey or the other kids either. At the time he changed Robert’s words, Ned expected to be the Hand/Regent. He would never have murdered the kids, not even Joffrey. In fact, after he did that he made the naïve mistake of warning Cersei so that she could flee with the kids.
My basic view is that I’m a lot harsher in judging people on what they actually do than on what they hypothetically might have done had the circumstances been different.
I also don’t think Ned was trying to murder Joffrey or the other kids either
What Ned was trying to do, and what was likely to happen, are two different things. Ned wasn’t trying to be Regent, he was already Regent, he was trying to put Stannis on the throne. And Stannis would gladly have murdered those three children to secure his own rule. What Ned intended isn’t really relevant to how you should judge his actions. And while I get the Joffrey snark, at this point the worst thing he’s done is lie about his fight with Arya, which isn’t an executable offense(the baker boy’s death belongs to Cersei and Sandor, IMO. Don’t put remorseless killers as your kid’s bodyguard people!).
My basic view is that I’m a lot harsher in judging people on what they actually do than on what they hypothetically might have done had the circumstances been different.
Except I’m not citing “hypotheticals” I’m citing what these characters tried to do, I’m just not factoring in their lack of success.
Theon and Sansa: He saved her from Ramsey and ran with her. He saved his sister, finally. Otherwise, he is a coward and has been faithless to everyone but I can see why Sansa would hug him.
When he chose to stay with Bran as protector he gave the reason he should stay “because I’m Iron Born”. I’m guessing that goes with the family motto that “what is dead already cannot die” but he didn’t go through the ritual like Euron. Maybe he “died” during his time with Ramsey.
I wish the Arya/Gendry coupling had been off camera. It was very awkward.
@33 – Ned was trying to thread the needle between getting Cersei and Jaime’s kids killed and acquiescing to treason. Doing the right things can be difficult when the easiest and most sure ways you achieve the right things contradict each other.
@21: She’s rescued them, not invaded them. It’s undeniable to any Northerner with a lick of sense that they won’t survive without her help.
@23: I’m not much of a fan of Jaime, in either the show or the books. His killing of the Mad King was the right thing to do, but he should never have been left on the Kingsguard after it (any more than you’d let a Secret Service agent who murdered the president keep his job), and it made perfect sense that people would judge him a faithless opportunist for it given that he dud so when his father was at the gates of the city. In that situation, a high position and a bad reputation are getting off pretty easily – and he could instantly have remidied the bad reputation by telling the truth, if not for his own stubborn pride. “There’s loads of wildfire buried under the city” is a verifiable claim. Instead he chose to keep silent and let resentment poison him further, which led yo all his subsequent evil deeds.
This episode brought to mind for me the before-the-battle scene in Henry V, but without the monarch giving the “We Happy Few” St. Crispin’s Day speech, which makes sense, because Daenerys is not yet (or maybe ever) revered by the North enough to function as battle cheerleader. Therefore the cheer was dispersed (and dispensed by Tyrion), and it was a rich tapestry of relationships and personalities.
@36 @21: She’s rescued them, not invaded them. It’s undeniable to any Northerner with a lick of sense that they won’t survive without her help.
Except she hasn’t done any of that yet. How they feel about her may change when she actually does it, just like their feelings about Jon changed when they saw him fighting to “save the North”. But she certainly hasn’t yet demonstrated they’ll survive WITH her help. And her dragons are eating all their food(I say this, because an unspoken component of the Dragon Flight scene is that Jon was showing her places they could hunt. D&D explicitly state that the falls their kiss took place at were “Jon’s old hunting grounds”).
I especially like your phrasing “lick of sense” since it’s been shown since season one that every Northerner feels that every 1 Northerner is worth 10 Southerners in combat, and that goes 20 for foreign eunuchs and “horsefuckers”(how the Dothraki are perceived). Northerners, known for their sensibility, they aren’t.
His killing of the Mad King was the right thing to do, but he should never have been left on the Kingsguard after it (any more than you’d let a Secret Service agent who murdered the president keep his job)
I mean, I agree with you, but this was a coup, and strongmen typically always keep the ex-loyalists who made their coup possible around, if just to watch them for inevitable betrayal. But I’m pretty sure keeping Jaime there was an agreement Tywin made so his son wouldn’t be disgraced. His options at the point were to keep him as KG, to give his actions legitimacy, or take the black.
“There’s loads of wildfire buried under the city” is a verifiable claim.
The claim as to whether there was Wildfire was already verified, we saw that it had all been stored, and then used in Blackwater Bay. What wasn’t verifiable was why Jaime killed the Mad King, because the other witnesses were also killed by Jaime to keep them from carrying out Aerys’s final command. Varys knew IIRC, but he’s not in a position to lessen tensions between the Lannisters and the Starks while he is waiting a true Targaryen in the wings.
And again, people are putting a lot of strength into this idea that Jaime has agency, when he does things like “not tell people why Aerys actually died”. He even points out that once Ned saw him sitting on the throne, there was nothing he could say to get Ned to believe him. And he’s right. Jaime had just done the greatest act of his entire life, and was immediately judged for it, because he chose literally the only place to sit, to sit down and reflect on the choice he’d just made.
I’m not trying to say Jaime can’t be judged for his actions. I am demonstrating that Jaime is not uniquely terrible by Westerosi standards. We just saw his worst action, before we really understood just how bad everyone else was, and that colors how we perceive Jaime.
It’s Jaime’s opinion that nothing he said could have changed Ned’s opinion of him. If he’d said “I killed him (and his Hand, a pyromancer) because there was a load of wildfire buried under the city and he was ordering the Hand to burn King’s Landing to the ground”, and they look and find that, hey, there’s a ton of wildfire under the city, that at least provides a plausible alternative explanation for his actions. Some may believe him, some may not, but it’s in the open.
But he chooses to stay silent and resent people’s opinion of him, despite knowing that everything about his action looks suspicious and opportunistic in the extreme.
And, this is trivial, but he could’ve sat on the floor. It’s not as though anyone is unaware of the symbolic significance of murdering a king and then sitting in his throne.
@39,You’ve met Ned. Ned’s opinion of the Lannisters is not based in reason, and he could not be reasoned out it. That’s how bigotries and biases work, and Ned was chock full of them, and it’s not “hurt ego” on Jaime’s part to recognize that.
My point, ultimately, is that the very first things we’re shown about Jaime are terrible, and that colors how we perceive him. The same is true for other characters. The first we see of Tyrion, he’s talking to Jon, building him up after he flees from the dinner. The fact that we like Jon, colors our perceptions of Tyrion, so when we later learn he’s as odious as the rest of them, what we learned first matters more.
I ask that we judge Jaime by the standards of all characters, because overall he holds as no better or worse than most of them, despite that the very first thing we saw him do was a terrible one.
@38 “I mean, I agree with you, but this was a coup, and strongmen typically always keep the ex-loyalists who made their coup possible around, if just to watch them for inevitable betrayal. But I’m pretty sure keeping Jaime there was an agreement Tywin made so his son wouldn’t be disgraced. His options at the point were to keep him as KG, to give his actions legitimacy, or take the black.”
Not sure I agree with the bolded. Tywin never wanted Jamie on the Kingsguard. There was definitely a path fo Jamie not being on the Kingsguard or taking the black that Tywin would have pursued if Jamie had given him the opportunity to. But with Cersei marrying Robert, Jamie would have wanted to stay.
@@@@@ 40 – What? In what universe is Ned’s opinion about the Lannisters irrational? He has a very excellent bead on Tywin and Cersei in particular. To him, Tywin Lannister is the guy who sat out most of Robert’s Rebellion while he (Ned) was risking life and limb to defy the Mad King, and made up for his fence-sitting by ordering the grisly murder of two children. He also must know Tywin by reputation; his intentions at Duskendale, The Rains of Castamere, his general attitude that non-Lannisters are sub-humans. After he is exposed in person to to Cersei Lannister, he sees that she and Robert despise each other, that she’s filled the court with her toadies, that she exerts too much influence on the king, his friend, and is driving him further and further away from actively governing the realm (not that there was much chance of that).
As for Tyrion, everyone thinks he’s a drunken fool. And Jaime is the Kingslayer. His time to confess to Ned was sixteen years previously. If Ned doesn’t believe him now, all these years later, can you blame him? After all, that seems awfully convenient, suspiciously so.
If Gendry standing in the shadows and watching Arya is “creeping”, what is it when Arya’s standing in the forge having a long eyeful of him earlier in the episode? Not that I can blame her…
I just re-watched the episode and I take it back: that looks like Maisie with Gendry. For some reason it didn’t last night, but it seems clear now.
I was so happy to see Ghost on screen, even if it was only for a heartbeat. Reminded me he’s still around and alive. Wonder if Arya’s wolf is too. Book she is, but we’ve left that land behind.
The Wargging aspect of the Starks, and even Bran has been rather neglected. Guess we will know the writers intend to use it if the flash back sections include a Wargging scene.
I thought Arya might go for something more fun when she left the “bitter old guys.” There was some chemistry, but no, not super high. Is Hot Pie even still alive? Or is he still in the Riverlands? Plus, she never made eyes at him. I don’t think her plan is to have a baby. Think she just wanted to experience an aspect of Life.
@41, No one retires from the Kingsguard, you either die, or are thrown out a traitor. If Jaime had been dismissed, for all that Tywin hated Jaime being there, would have been a stain on House Lannister. And at that point, I think Tywin could have cared less what Jaime wanted, all Tywin cared about was how the family looked.
@42 If Ned doesn’t believe him now, all these years later, can you blame him?
Except again, Ned was never going to believe him. Read Ned’s chapters again, his ridiculous hang up over Jaime sitting in the only place to sit, how he never stops to question WHY Jaime did what he did, because CHAIR, and how he’d already made up his mind about Jaime when he recounts the story. Jaime isn’t wrong. And Ned was talking shit about the “Lannister woman” before he ever met Cersei again, and saw her marriage to Robert.
I like Ned, a lot, and I think he is one of the better people in this series in how he prioritized his family, as people who actually mattered, who had agency, instead of just extensions of himself and his legacy. But that’s really not saying much. He’s still a product of his environment, still steeped in unexamined biases(his bias against Tyrion is based more in his physical revulsion to Tyrion’s deformity than his drunken lechery, remember he loves Robert, another drunken whoremonger, like a brother), and he was never going to believe a Lannister acted out altruism, even if the wierwood gave him the vision as he meditated in the Kingswood. It is one of the many blind spots Ned has, and I wish more people would consider that when they judge other characters by that standard.
@45, IIRC, Arya ran into Nymeria after she left the Twins and was deciding whether to return to Winterfell. That moment was another in her journey away from vengeance. She met Nymeria and saw that they could no longer communicate with one another, that Nymeria couldn’t leave the pack she’d built and go back to the way things were on the Kingsroad, and it paralleled with what Arya was struggling with, whether she should continue on her quest for vengeance, or if she should look into the rumors that the Starks had retaken Winterfell. Pretty much she decided she had to keep moving forward, instead of getting mired in her slights from the past. Which is pretty much when her list “died”.
“But it does feel strange to see her with this heretofore unmentioned burning curiosity about sex before she dies. It just seemed kinda random.”
Random? It’s the most human Arya has allowed herself to be in a long time. And Gendry has been established as Arya’s soft spot for years now. Since she showed up flirting with him in Episode 1, it was glaringly obvious a pairing was in the cards.
I cried a river over Brienne’s knighting! Her face! Podrick’s face!
I disagree that Brienne shouldn’t be paired off with anyone. Daenerys, Arya or Sansa don’t need to be paired off (though they all already have, one way or the other), but Brienne needs to know that she deserves love. I’m happy to see that there are two men circling around her now, and I’m ever happier seeing how much Tormund respects her.
@@@@@ 43: “If Gendry standing in the shadows and watching Arya is “creeping”, what is it when Arya’s standing in the forge having a long eyeful of him earlier in the episode? Not that I can blame her…”
EXACTLY. Plus Gendry just now starts seeing Arya as a grown, desirable woman, whereas he has been Arya’s crush for years, now.
@46 – I don’t actually disagree overall with your general points about Ned and Jaime and their complexities as characters and the lessons to be learned there about our biases and blind spots, but aren’t the POVs we get of Ned several years after the fact, after these ideas have calcified? It’s theoretically possible that at the time, they may have been more malleable had Jamie actually spoken up. Or maybe not…
@46: I like your analysis of Ned’s character.
Ned Stark is a good, decent, honorable character, and we all cried when he died. But he is also rigid, and small-minded, and judgmental as all hell. As a queer person, I have met many Ned Starks in my life, and most of them have looked down on me from their moral high ground, no matter how good at heart they are.
“Everyone should see how beautiful Brienne is, inside and out!”
That’s because Gwendoline Christie is a stunning woman, and hard to disfigure. The Wench of Tarth is supposed to be a very ugly woman, at least physically, and further disfigured by scars later on, IIRC.
I wasn’t happy about Christie’s casting precisely because of her beauty, as I was opposed to pretty boy Viggo Mortensen’s casting as Aragorn. Of course both proved me wrong, and won my heart, and have come to embody their characters for me.
@39 This is also very true.
But Jaime is also a character used to secrecy, to playing everything close to his vest, and also very proud. IMHO, he decides to stay silent because he thinks he does not care about what other people think of him. It turns out he does, but that comes back to haunt him.
Jaime is a very tragic figure, and all these things shape him.
@Lisamarie
It’s theoretically possible that at the time
I mean theoretically a lot is possible. If we’d ever been given a glimpse of Ned reassessing his decisions in life, I’d be more willing to grant it.
Goodbye, Brother.
It was a pleasant episode, making us remember why these characters feel so real in the first place. Much like Tyrion by the fireside, we don’t want the night to end. Alas, like all good things, it must.
That big smile on Brienne’s face will always make me cry like a baby. A nice closure for the first Lady Knight. I reeeeally hope she doesn’t die in the next episode.
In another choice, Sansa vs. Dany. Is keeping the North independent really that smart? I have my doubts. There’s no way any single kingdom could remain independent for long, at least not when the others could simply join forces against it. I guess Dorne managed to resist the Targaryen conquest in the past, but that has always stretched my suspension of disbelief, to be honest. The Greyjoys and their failed rebellions are a better example. By the way, I didn’t care for that Theon reunion either.
Also, why is it Dany who should be reasonable in this situation? She has the largest army and two freaking dragons. If the Lady of Winterfell is as smart as everyone says she is, being burned alive should be a valid concern. Sansa could play the game and say whatever Dany wants to hear, at least until the Night King is gone, or Dany’s army becomes weaker (which is almost certain to happen next episode – RIP Grey Worm). I do like that Sansa’s thinking ahead to what happens after the war, though. That makes me think she should be safe for a few episodes.
PS: Putting Ghost in a blink-and-you’ll-miss-it scene felt like a slap on the face of all the fans who’ve been crying “WHERE’S GHOST?” since season six. They might as well have put a caption reading: THERE, ARE YOU HAPPY NOW?
PPS: What’s with the constant height jokes? Maybe it’s part of Kit Harington’s contract, to make up for the fact that he’s being paid more than anyone else.
s keeping the North independent really that smart? I have my doubts. There’s no way any single kingdom could remain independent for long, at least not when the others could simply join forces against it.
I mean, they were all independent at one time, that’s why they are called the Seven Kingdoms. And the North has as much landmass as the other 6 put together, with only one pathway in or out, through the swamps at The Neck. They could only be conquered by dragons. And Dany is trying very hard not be seen as a brutal Targaryen, and roasting the Lady of Winterfell for speaking for her people would not help her here.
Dany of course recognizes that if she cuts one kingdom loose, she’ll have 6 others asking “Why not us too” and be the ruler of 0 kingdoms. But that’s my preferred ending, so *shrug*
“Is Hot Pie even still alive? Or is he still in the Riverlands? Plus, she never made eyes at him.”
Wasn’t Hot Pie the one who told Arya that Sansa had taken Winterfell? So alive then. She didn’t really show affection to him until after he said that, too busy wolfing food.
Doesn’t the Iron Throne have steps leading up to it? One could sit there, if worried about sitting on the throne. And it does seem like Jaime’s pride and assumptions made trouble for himself.
@56 – “I guess Dorne managed to resist the Targaryen conquest in the past, but that has always stretched my suspension of disbelief, to be honest.”
Dorne did not try to fight major battles with the Targaryens, especially if the there were dragons in the field. Their leader ship fought an unconventional war. This was helped by Dorne being very far away from King’s Landing and Dragonstone, being accessible by land forces through a desert and the fact the Targaryens did not have enough dragons to cover everywhere plus the Dornish managed to kill one. There is a good description of the wars against Dorne and how they confounded the Targs in Fire and Blood.
@34 – Didn’t Theon do the drowning ceremony before the Kingsmoot on the Iron Islands? I seem to remember it. I could be wrong though, it’s been a while!
As for his reunion with Sansa, the thing that resonated the most for me, is that they grew up together. They were almost like brother and sister during the good times before the war when Theon was Ned’s ward. With that, plus their shared horror at the hands of Ramsey, Sansa shares more with Theon than anyone else left alive. Not only does he share her worst memories, he also shares her best memories. I cried at their reunion.
I can’t see them as a romance, but I definitely can see why they are important to each other.
It’s only recently (browsing reddit and similar) that I’ve realized Sansa and Theon’s gaze at the end was apparently launching ships. That was supposed to be romantic??? I also took it as two people being able to form a (plationic) relationship based on shared memories and trauma. No, I don’t actually like Theon all that much, but I can still see why from Sansa’s point of view, she’d feel some closeness/kinship with him given their shared history.
I also wonder if that scene will have an added payoff, in that it interrupted Sansa and Dany’s icy moment. I felt like there was something in Dany’s face there, perhaps seeing how much loyalty the Starks actually command, even from her own vassals. That could of course either turn out really bad, or really good, lol.
As for the romance, while I suppose it could happen, I’ve seen a lot of people (on other internet places, not here), ‘oh, it’s perfect, because Sansa was traumatized, and Theon is a eunuch’ and I’m like…really? That’s the best a sexual assault victim can hope for? Now, OBVIOUSLY, as we see with Grey Worm/Missandei, there can be a loving and even sexual relationship there. And sometimes sexual assault victims do end up either unable, or not wanting to, have other sexual relationships. (And, given that there are no psychologists in Westeros, maybe that’s about as far as Sansa will get). But it also seems a bit simplistic to just assume that now this must be Sansa’s ideal partner. (Then again, some were saying that there were hints that Sansa herself was also mutilated which I don’t recall AT ALL from the show but I could have missed it…)
I dunno, I’m not a trauma victim, so I can’t speak for them, but it didn’t sit right with me. (Plus, the fact that they were raised brother and sister should invoke that psychological phenomenon that causes kids raised together to view each other sexually as blood relations…can’t remember the name).
@61, I knew that it would launch ships, because if there is anything the internet can be counted on to do, it’s launch revolting ships(waves at Reylo/SkyeWard).
But I agree with you that it’s a platonic thing.
And it also shows that for all the wisdom she’s earned, she’s still that girl that believes in fairy tales.
I mean, there is a wonderful narrative symmetry in Theon now protecting Bran and Winterfell after his past actions, but NOBODY stops to think that relying on solely the Ironborn for this is a terrible idea??? People who think “what is dead may never die” and here comes a man who can actually give them that!!!
But I can’t really blame Sansa for that either. The part of Sansa that still believes this can play out like it does in fairy tales, that supported Theon in the War room, is the same part that was moved by Brienne’s testimony for Jaime. And I really liked that part.
And who knows, maybe she is right.
I’m also half convinced the show is faking us out about the crypts. I’m seeing now, that Jon will finally realize how bad of an idea it was to put everyone down there, once he sees the Night King and remembers Hardhome, and he’ll send Samwell down there, and Sam races to get down there, and we’re all expecting the worst, and then we’ll see there is magic in the crypts, that works to keep the dead, well dead, so long as a Stark in residence.
> that psychological phenomenon that causes kids raised together to view each other sexually as blood relations
Westermarck effect, aka reverse sexual imprinting.
Of course, that should really rule out Jaime/Cersei too, unless they were raised apart.
The reverse is genetic sexual attraction, which would feed into Jon and Dany humping like aphrodisiac-crazed bunnies. Close relatives who first meet as horny young adults? Ruh-roh!
@61, @62 How old was Theon when he came to Winterfell? I think the Westermarck Effect applies to upbringing between very small children, Wikipedia says under age six.
@64, The Siege of Pyke is in 289 AC according to the AWOIAF wiki, Theon was 9, Sansa was born in 286 AC, so she was 3 when he arrived.
My family is basically the Targaryens, minus dungeons and dragons. I’m lucky my mother chose an exogamous marriage; otherwise I’d probably glow in the dark or something.
Anyway, what’s with the “someone taller” joke? Kit Harington is 5’8″, which is about average for a male, and he still towers over Emilia Clarke, who is tiny. Still taller than Maisie Williams, though –and both of them are living proof that the best perfumes come in small bottles.
Though I confess that Jon’s reunion with Sansa made me laugh out loud, as she had to hunch down so she could hug him…
Full disclosure: I’m 5’8″ and a male. Argh!
@66, Compared to Drogo, Jon is tiny.
There is a funny meme making the rounds of Kit Harrington and Jason Momoa posing for a pic together, and Kit’s face is like Neutral AF, while Jason has his great wide smile shining, and the caption is “When you meet her ex”
“Unlike Arya, this is one face I don’t want to see.”
I was wondering if Arya’s comment about just that might have been a clue as to how the dead may be defeated. Thinking that possibly Arya kills the dead king with her newly made lance and takes his “face” to re-direct the dead army to slaughter. THEN, still wearing the dead king’s “face,” gets killed in turn by her sister . . .
@67: Argh!
Yes, I’ve seen that photo, as it’s just so not fair. That’s Jason Fracking Momoa, for chrissakes! No one else can compare. There’s even a saying: “Once you go Momoa, you’re Krakatoa.”
Speaking of Jason Momoa and being not fair:
HBO Backstories: “Game of Thrones”
David Benioff drunkenly challenged Jason Momoa to the slap game, and it went poorly for him.
I’m ready for the conclusion. It’s only been 23 years.
My thanks for the great theories – with substantiating supporting logic – on this thread! Submitted for your disapproval:
Jaime will reluctantly take the Iron Throne. From Kingslayer to King. It doesn’t get more ironic.
Brienne will survive and head-up the Kingsguard declining the role of Queen whilst eyeing Jaime speculatively.
Tormund and Podrick will die guarding Brienne’s back at the Battle of Winterfell. Jorah will die for Dany.
The Hound will kill the Mountain and join the Kingsguard. Or he’ll die of his injuries…that’s a tossup.
Dany and Jon survive and forswear the Iron Throne. They’ll be off to Mereen with the Golden Company, taking the Dothraki and the last dragon to Essos with them. She’ll find more eggs, maybe courtesy of Varys or that fork-bearded guy.
Sansa will be the Lady of Winterfell and the autonomous Protector of the North. Theon dies heroically saving her. There must always be a Stark at Winterfell.
Arya and Gendry survive. We’ve lost plenty of Starks already. A Stark/Baratheon heir? They’ll roam Westeros, and then Essos.
Bran will likely die with the Night King. Okay, just one more Stark. No more creepy prophets. GRRM did originally call the last volume ‘A Time For Wolves’ after all.
Euron is toast. All of the blackest die.
Grey Worm and Missandei might survive. Maybe. I like ’em but small beer.
Dolorous Edd may survive, Lyanna Mormont will survive.
Samwell and Gilly will return to the Citadel, he as Grand Maester. They’ll collaborate on the Song of Ice and Fire.
Bronn will survive and deploy Joffrey’s crossbow on Qyburn.
Robin Arryn will fly.
Melisandre will show up with a coven or two of Red Witches to swing the tide of battle on Sunday. She dies as she has foretold.
Varys will survive the Battle of Winterfell and be cooked by Dany’s surviving dragon. Melisandre said their time was limited. Why? Varys broke faith with Dany who threatened to have him rotisseried if he did so. Between the Dornish fleet debacle and the Casterly Rock feint, someone fed Cersei intel. Who left the council meeting first?
Tyrion is a tough one. A patricide like Ramsay Bolton, and a strangler of Shae. Will his vast crimes be rewarded with getting two job offers as Hand of the King/Queen? Or will he die throttling Cersei?
Davos Seaworth? Hand-worthy.
GRRM warned it would be a bittersweet ending.
And what scares the hell out of Arya? The dead are inside the castle says Dany. My guess is that it is Lady Stoneheart – not a minion of the Night King – who will finally hear the truth of Jon’s lineage. She will finally die for good. Yeah, another Stark.
And I predict Jaqen h’Ghar will show up as himself – or as his alter-ego Syrio Forel – who was never definitively killed. I mean really. They are both deadly assassins from Braavos and both have a focused interest in Arya.
Your mileage may Varys.
There is, of course, only one answer to this dilemma: “Hello. I’m Brienne; this is my husband Tormund, and this is my other husband, Jaime.”
@@@@@ Bruce
Your list is cool, but I just don’t see that ending.
The Hound killing his brother would be undoing all his development as a character.
The continued existence of dragons, fire made flesh, necessitates the continued existence of it’s opposite, ice made flesh. I think there is only peace if both dragons and walkers are gone.
And if any Lannister remains on the throne, it will be Tyrion, not Jaime. Recall Jon’s first glimpse of Tyrion, when he cast a shadow of a king.
@72 I like your thinking. I’m firmly in the why not both camp. ;)
Great conversations going here, people. Today my thoughts make me most worried about Grey Worm and my favorite Debbie Downer, Dolorous Edd. I love Edd and it just seems like the Night’s Watch will be much less needed for a time after the White Walkers march south and it’d be a natural conclusion to his story. I loved him, Jon, and Sam mentioning Grenn and other fallen brothers. It was a poignant moment.
Re Brienne’s Dilemma: I’d like her to have a confidence-building tryst with Jaime and then go on and marry Tormund.
Plus, let’s face it, people, we all know how Jaime is going down, and with whom. I don’t think he can survive that, or even want to…
@75, Yeah, I like Jaime as a character, but Brienne deserves better, and Jaime was shitty to Brienne at the start, and Tormund has admired her since he laid eyes on her.
Also relevant
Also, feel this is a good moment to fill in show only people, that in the books, the girl that Robb Stark married that screwed his alliance with the Freys, was from a family called the Spicers, who made their wealth and house by importing, well, spices.
Their heraldry was a pepper pot.
A Stark married a Pepper Pott(s). So all the crossover jokes about the MCU and GOT were as Martin intended.
Ah-ha, thanks for that :)
@76: THANOS?
Sorry, I know Thanos but I’m not very well-versed in the MCU, so these jokes fly WAY over my head… :-(
In Avengers Endgame this weekend, Thanos and Tony Stark will face off. Just as this weekend the Stark family will face off against the Night King.
A little genre crossover, is all.
@80: Oooooooh, thank you for this! :-D
Nice read, but I hope the script writers don’t listen too much to fan input like this. You want everything morally right. You want people to get their just rewards and to kill the patriarchy. Ok, I do also hope for some justice and reward for the righteous, but one of the greatest strengths of GoT is the unsentimental portrayal of a harsh medieval society.
And applying today’s moral (or juridical) standards on that society? What on earth does for instance Aryas age matter? If she was 16, so what? Couldn’t 16 y’rs old have sexual feelings? I agree that her sudden(?) urge was a bit out of character for the controlled killer Arya, but there were certainly signs that it was coming. Maybe her days as a serial killer in the service of the two faced god is coming to an end and she is rejoining the normal society.
https://www.tor.com/2019/04/16/time-is-a-bloody-spiral-between-winter-is-coming-and-winterfell-game-of-thrones/#comments
https://www.tor.com/2019/04/12/were-bad-guys-its-what-we-do-suicide-squad/
https://www.tor.com/2019/04/19/end-all-wars-wonder-woman-2017/
https://www.tor.com/2018/03/23/youre-an-even-more-screwed-up-mess-than-i-thought-ang-lees-hulk/
Wow, Arya sure wasn’t impressed after her shag with Gendy, was she? But her having sex with him was definitely a move towards trying to reclaim her humanity, as was not staying to hang out with the Hound and Dondarion.
Loved Jorah being honorable, and Lyanna badass as always.
I found it funny how Tormund said he would have “knighted” Brienne ten times already. Wa-hey!
@Theresa: Dany IS a dictator and quite possibly insane, and I would say the same about a man. And she’s not angry that Jon is her nephew, it’s more about him being the true heir of the Targ throne.
@2 – Rob: Yeah, Bran’s line was on point.
@3 – Lisamarie: This episode was beautiful, and whoever criticizes it for being just people talking is daft. And yes, Arya’s awkwardness was intentional.
@6 – Crusader: You mean, when Arya was like, 12-13?
@16 – Jaime: That Arya plot does not sound in character at all.
@53 – Ashgrove: I don’t think Christie is ugly, but she’s definitely not a woman of “conventional” or “mainstream” beauty. She doesn’t need to be disfigured and scarred to not fit within the beauty and feminity standards of Westeros; her non-traditional looks, size and predisposition to combat and other “manly” activities are more than enough.
@61 – Lisamarie: Ugh, people launch ships at the slightest thing… I mean, I can get it when it involves non-hetero relationships that are sorely missing from mainstream entertainment, but this? Please, no.
@77 – Aeryl: Heh, cool tidbit.
@37 – You beat me to it. I immediately thought of the scene depicting the night before the Battle of Agincourt in Henry V. While the overconfident French knights party the night away already celebrating their anticipated victory, the miserable English soldiers pass the night quietly around campfires contemplating their likely deaths, unable to sleep.
I choked up as Brienne was knighted. Gwendolyn Christie is so totally committed to her character and gives her unbelievable strength, integrity, and dignity. One of the very best in a fine cast. Her reactions to Tormund are priceless.