We thought it was weird when Marvel Studios didn’t delve into Phase 3 at all during San Diego Comic-Con. But clearly they intended to mete out the details, what with releasing the Avengers: Age of Ultron trailer months after SDCC, publishing a bunch of on-set interviews, and now announcing details of Phase 3 through the “Marvel Event” liveblog today.
Kevin Feige, Joss Whedon, Robert Downey Jr., and Chris Evans are on-hand to talk about new release dates, new movies (Captain Marvel WHAT), and Avengers out the wazoo.
Here’s everything they announced:
- Kevin Feige and Joss Whedon were there to screen the Avengers: Age of Ultron trailer.
- Captain America 3: Civil War: May 6, 2016! (Not Serpent Society, as the Marvel folks joked at first.) Chris Evans: “This is heartbreaking for me…” We knew it.
- Doctor Strange: November 4, 2016. With director Scott Derrickson, still no Doctor Strange announced.
- Guardians of the Galaxy 2 has been moved up from July to May 5, 2017.
- Thor 3: Ragnarok will come out July 28, 2017.
- Robert Downey Jr. and Chris Evans are there!
- Wait, Marvel, you have even more new movies to announce? YES.
- Black Panther: November 3, 2017.
- Chadwick Boseman, cast as Black Panther, joined the event. Downey: “Welcome to the fray. Get used to that applause.”
- The Avengers: Infinity War will be a two-parter, out May 4, 2018 and May 3, 2019.
- And here’s Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet!
- Captain Marvel: July 6, 2018. Feige confirmed that this will be the Carol Danvers Captain Marvel. YES.
- Inhumans: November 2, 2018!
That’s all the big news! Now, for more reveals from the Q&A:
- Feige wanted to reveal everything at SDCC, but not everything had come together.
- Why didn’t they include the Doctor Strange casting today? Feige: “If it was confirmed, we would have announced it today.”
- We will see Black Panther in Civil War in costume—so, he’ll be announced by then.
- Will Cosmo be in Guardians 2? “The great thing about Guardians is there’s no lack of awesome characters we can work with. Is Cosmo going to come back? Will he speak? What’s that duck doing? Where’s the Collector?”
- Soon they’ll be announcing the writer and director for Captain Marvel, though Feige joked that the rumors will probably be flying soon. Nothing yet on casting.
- Yes, Hulk will show up in many of the movies mentioned in today’s slate, including the new Avengers film. “What happens with a standalone Hulk film? We’ll see. We’d love to find the place to put it.”
- Feige was asked about both the Russo brothers directing the new Avengers movies, and if Spider-Man would join Marvel, but he said he still can’t confirm or deny until everything is worked out.
- Ant-Man is the end of Phase 2, Captain America 3: Civil War is the beginning of Phase 3.
- The Avengers will go through Wakanda in Ultron.
- Marvel Studios will look for minority and female directors for Black Panther and Captain Marvel. (Just like Warner Bros.)
- We’ll learn more about Inhumans soon—“Easter eggs before you know it.”
- They would love to do something with The Runaways someday. The script is still in the vault, and it’s a solid draft, but “we can’t make them all.”
- Why didn’t they announce a Black Widow movie? Feige emphasized that, like Hulk, Black Widow has a big role in the upcoming Avengers films. She “couldn’t be a more important character” in those movies, but “today’s presentation was all about introducing new characters.”
- How will they transition to Civil War? “Needless to say, the generalities of the act are the same. Something happens, perhaps it’s cumulative leading up to this point. The governments of the world may say, ’We need to have some oversight of these guys.’ So it falls under that umbrella versus ’take off our mask.’ It’s not about a secret identity thing.”
Er, wasn’t Cumberbatch just confirmed as Dr. Strange yesterday?
Anyway, neat, they’re bumping up the schedule from 2 to 3 films a year!
Black Panther!
Carol Danvers!
Infinity War!
Inhumans!
Wow! make mine Marvel indeed!
Woot!
That is all.
I’m good with all of this.
@1 Nope. It was rumored that they were in talks and the he was their choice for it, but nothing confirmed yet.
The things I’m most excited for on this is the Carol Danvers Captain Marvel and Black Panther, as well as the Inhumans. MCU is making some awesome moves for the next phase.
OK, I guess.
Anyway, the timing of the films in 2018-2019 is interesting. I suspect they might try to tie Captain Marvel and the Inhumans into the whole Infinity War arc to try to bolster two properties that are cosmic in origin, but don’t necessarily have as much name recognition. I wonder how that will all play out.
@1 From the way everything is phrased, it seems that Cumberbatch is still working out the actual contract (think of it as that point where you’re told that you’re hired but haven’t signed the paperwork about your pay & benefits yet), so they can’t announce it in this sort of venue. In fact, I wouldn’t be surprised if it were his people who leaked the news that they were at that stage simply to help grease the wheels — Marvel is notorious for lowballing actors who aren’t RDJr. and it would be bad p.r. for them to have BC have to drop out now over pay issues.
Having Captain Marvel and The Inhumans both coming out between the two parts of Avengers 3 makes me think — both seem to necessarily involve the Kree, who are tied in with Thanos, who would be the big bad of the two-parter. I really wonder to what degree Marvel is going to basically use this to have many of their movies take place basically at the same time: how many Phase 3 films in 2018 (and even obliquely eaarlier than that, depending on how things like GOTG2 works in 2017, for example) are going to basically lead up to the same point and continue/funnel into 2019’s Infinity Way Part 2? It seems to be the next evolution in how Phase 1 worked with the first Avengers film…
Very glad they’re finally giving Carol Danvers a movie — and that they’re calling her Captain Marvel instead of Ms. Marvel. But it is totally bizarre that they haven’t already moved immediately on a Black Widow solo movie. That was a no-brainer as soon as The Winter Soldier came out, if not as soon as The Avengers came out.
Of everything announced, I am most excited about the Black Panther. I really, really hope they don’t mess it up. The Black Panther is such a great character, and they have done so little with him.
Using one of Cap’s films for Civil War seems a really smart move, as they’ve already marked his area of the Marvel U as the one for politics, divided loyalties and back room scheming. I just hope it remains focused primarily on him rather than being an Iron Man / Cap double header, because I’m really enjoying Chris Evans in that role.
Also great to see that they’re including Carol Danvers and Black Panther.
@8 My guess on the Black Widow not getting a movie is that it’s not in SJ’s current contract and they can’t lowball her on a new contract and aren’t willing to shell out the cash.
It’s not really that bizarre that a Black Widow movie hasn’t been announced. This other stuff has all been rumored for a long time, there’s nothing THAT surprising here. The talk about a Black Widow solo movie really took off after Cap 2.
Easter Eggs for Inhumans soon?
Keep watching Agents of Shield folks
They really are at their limit, schedule-wise. (Remember that Disney’s also going to be putting out a Star Wars every December on this timeline, as well as whatever the animation studios are doing.)
So, after Avengers 3.2, what should they do? Phase 4 or reboot? Assume for the sake of argument that all of the big three Avengers’ actors are done with the characters at that point and that no further character rights have reverted to Marvel.
Ms. Marvel aka Captain Marvel, you know Carol Danvers, is my favourite super hero by far. The 2010 54 comic run is my favourite run of comics. Okay, ya, I really enjoyed the Dark Phoenix Saga and others, but I adore Ms. Marvel, so they better do it right, or I will Hulk out.
I would hate to see a reboot of the MCU at any point. I think it’s fantastic that they’ve finally found a way to translate the comic book experience to film (after random film-makers spending years trying to get it stylistically, leave it to Marvel to realize that it’s not a style but an experience, and that experience is rooted in a continuous, expanding universe), and a basic reboot would betray that experience for me.
Now, there are other ways to start fresh. Maybe an Ultimate Marvel Cinematic Universe could be in our future.
I think that a major reason that Black Widow hasn’t had a movie is that, like Nick Fury, she’s really been (in these movies) a character that works best paired against other characters. We’ve seen her paired as the professional versus the amateur Stark, the shades-of-gray versus the black-and-white Rogers, and the in-control verus on-the-edge Banner. Likewise, we know that there’s a lot with here and Barton behind the scenes that we don’t see — in general, Natasha is a character that works partly as well as she does because of her secrets (once more, like Fury), secrets that would be lost if she was the main protagonist and had to carry the story the way that a main protagonist does. Instead, Marvel has does an interesting thing of building her character as a major supporting character across films (which I’m pretty certain is going to continue, ScarJo-willing), allowing her to be that pseudo-cipher that Widow has always been.
I also think that Scarlett Johansen is following the same path as Jeremy Renner and Samuel L. Jackson. She’s an established star with other films that she’s the main star of. In any Marvel film, Marvel is as much of the star as you are. As a secondary character, you don’t have as much time commitment, so you can do other (better-paying) work if you have the credentials. The Chrises Hemsworth and Evans, for example, have used these roles to really establish themselves — and Robert Downey Jr. used his to rebuild himself in Hollywood — but many established names are more likely to play secondary parts since Marvel isn’t paying top dollar (and they don’t need to).
Plus, keep in mind that she DID get pregnant during rechoots and post-production on WINTER SOLDIER, so I doubt that she would have been able to jump right into a BLACK WIDOW film at that point, especially with other action commitments lined up following that.
My major hope for GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY 2 is very simple: I want them to work the arrival of Vance Astro into the movie. I just want to see them meet another Earthman and Rocket remark something like “Wait, so you’re saying all Terrans aren’t assholes!?”
It just seems like the natural sort of interpersonal conflict to introduce amidst whatever galactric crisis is happening this week…
@14 & 16: I don’t think a reboot would be necessary if the lead roles were recast. The MCU has already recast one of its lead characters, Bruce Banner, as well as the supporting characters Jim Rhodes, Howard Stark, and Fandral. So there’s no reason they couldn’t recast the other leads and just carry the same continuity forward.
True, Downey, Evans, Johanssen, Hemsworth, and Jackson would be hard acts to follow, but then, so was Sean Connery. There’s a long tradition of Hollywood film series recasting their lead actors without “rebooting,” from Frankenstein to Tarzan to Bond to Batman to Jack Ryan.
@14: I’d think a Phase 4 (or at least a “next phase” has to be likelier than a reboot, given that a third Guardians of the Galaxy film seems highly probable barring the total implosion of the franchise.
As to the character/actor issues, the Civil War story arc should give the writers a good way to engineer recasts of both Iron Man and Captain America into the primary continuity — and by that time, odds seem good that Spider-Man might be available to replace Thor in the Avenger lineup.
And likewise by that time, they’ll likely have worked out the rights issues needed to choreograph the entry of their next major archvillain…for whom my guess would be the one and only Victor von Doom.
@20: There are rumors out there that Avengers 3.2 will also be, for all intents and purposes, Guardians of the Galaxy 3.
Also, von Doom is out of the question; the Fantastic Four rights are in another castle. Um, studio. Which also rules out any Skrull-involving stories like the Kree-Skrull War or Secret Invasion.
Kang is pretty much what you’re left with outside of Captain America’d Nazi baddie gallery. Speaking of which, Thunderbolts would be a good way to launch a phase 4…
@21: Given Fox’s track record with Fantastic Four movies, I am assuming that the reboot due out next year will tank (Toby Kebbell as Doom????), and Marvel will thereby be able to dicker successfully with Fox to get the rights back.
@19: What would be nice, and what I’m prepared for in the short term, is not to have the major characters recast very much, but rather to see the mantles passed on, and heroes phased in and out. Whereas recasts are not remotely unheard of, the comic book experience I was talking about means this is a big enough universe that we don’t need Tony Stark to be Iron Man all the time, and we don’t always even need Iron Man at all.
But I was also just thinking that, eventually, MCU Prime is going to feel perfunctory, or is going to go through a weak period, and that might be a time when an alternate Marvel Universe will offer a fresh start (not unlike Days of Future Past). I don’t think that lull will come as soon as phase 4 — I personally expect we’ll be peaking as phase 4 gets going. But when it does, I’d much rather see a comic book style explanation, like an Ultimate MCU, for the refresh than just a classic Hollywood cold reset.
I wonder if the Inhumans are how they are going to introduce Mutants into the ABC/ Disney Marvel Universe. Like, there could be whole generations of Inhumans exposed to the Mists who got “Lost” or went on a walkabout and never came back or something. It would be a clever way to get around the whole “We cant say Mutants in any of our movies cause Marvel sold those rights to a different company before we bought them up.” problem.
Likewise, I wonder if some of the “why don’t they…” movies that folks imagine are being held back for the very reason that you don’t have the major tentpins that built the MCU hanging on in full capacity into Phase 4 and beyond. Even introducing new characters like Doctor Strange, Black Panther, and Captain Marvel — major players who can expand the universe laterally — at this point is showing how you can set up new directions for the future past 2019. Even that we see a mix of mainly new characters in tie-ins like AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D. (and note that Phil Coulson was brand new; they could have used any of a hundred comics agents in his place in the first IRON MAN) suggests that we’ll continue to see at least new supporting characters or complete reinventions of supporting character IPs in properties going forward (how many characters in the movies have been name-only-from-the-IP new characters?).
Obviously, the Marvel Cinematic Universe won’t last forever — nothing does. However, I don’t think that Marvel Studios is assuming that the continuity is closing shop after Summer 2019. I think that they want to wait to announce any Phase 4 until things in Phase 3 are actually happening, but I can imagine that there are at least brainstorming about how they think that a post IRON MAN-CAPTAIN AMERICA-THOR Marvel Cinematic Universe will look. There might still be an Avengers, and the likes of Hulk may even well be involved and finally getting another movie — think of it like when a new writer comes onto a book after a long run by one author ends; 2019 may well end the Whedon era, for example…
@19, My problem with the recasts is this:
Part of the fun has been having the actors playing the same characters and crossing over and interacting with the other films and the shows.
It’s different from Bond, which is only a solo franchise and can easily do that.
Excitement!
Except that it’s not a recast like 3 actors playing Batman in the 1980s-90s continuity, or two actors to play Batman in the current DCU continuity. It’s one character stepping up and putting on the suit of another character who has died, or quit, or is similarly indisposed. It’s not like we’re going to be asked to believe that Capt America has always looked like Sebastian Stan and forget he was ever played by Chris Evans, it will be that Bucky Barnes is putting on the suit because Steve Rogers is absent.
No, only one. The Christian Bale movies are a completely separate continuity from the current movie universe that began with Man of Steel.
Maybe. That’s one way of doing it; the other way is to recast Steve Rogers or Tony Stark or whoever. Nobody is confusing those two approaches, so you don’t need to explain why they’re different. But it could go either way. Obviously Marvel Studios is not opposed to recasting a character.
@11 Marvel has ALL the money at this point. I doubt that paying SJ is the issue. More likely is that “they” don’t think the character can support a standalone movie. (I think she can)
What’s the point of having not only one, but two Infinity War movies, if I can’t see my favorite scene from that arc: Thanos transforming Wolverine’s adamantium skeleton into a rubber skeleton. That scene was imprinted on my mind when I was young and reading that arc for the first time. But now, due to business reasons, I’m unable to see it in live action movie. Still sad about that. I’ll have to settle with the scene where Thanos kills half of the universe to court Death.
@24: Exactly. Inhumans are mutants, and Marvel has been quite obviously doing that in the comics for a while. (For example, the new Ms. Marvel.)
Kevin Feige and others at Marvel have said they’re talking about a Black Widow movie, but scheduling a movie is a little more complicated than saying they want to do it, I think. I doubt it’s a matter of lacking confidence in Johansson; she’s one of the bigger stars in the franchise–who else other than Robert Downey Jr. is comparable in name recognition?–and Lucy was pretty succcessful. And Guardians was basically their proof that unknown Marvel titles can do really well. I mean, would anyone think that Black Widow is a bigger stretch than The Inhumans?
So assuming that Scarlett Johansson is still interested in doing it in 2019 or 2020, I imagine that we will see it get announced in a couple of years.
@33, I think it’s more contingent if she gets the role for Ghost in the Shell.
And nothing giving leading status to the breakout star of the entire Marvel franchise. Where’s the Loki movie?
My suspicion is that Phase 3 will be the end – or at least, a passing of the baton – for our initial Marvel heroes. Steve Rogers, Tony Stark, Thor, etc. We might get Bucky (or Sam) as Captain America in phase 4? Chris Evans or RDJ could even show up as a big surprise in one movie and pave the road for a return. There’s no point in someone else playing Tony Stark in the next 20 years. Stark is RDJ.
But I think at the end of this phase, we’ll be moving on. The actors will be given some flexibility and will be offered deals and *may* come back in some capacity or another.
Marvel has already been thinking about how they’ll continue beyond this, without depending on those stars. They’re gonna go full-on cosmic with the success they’ve had with GotG, and are hoping to continue that with Captain Marvel and the Inhumans. And there will be a new set of heroes on earth too (Strange, Ant Man, Black Panther, etc.). Honestly, I think it’s going to be a very interesting ride.
#35, Loki is the on that causes Ragnorak
@36, I agree, Marvel is introducing the heroes that will be integrated into the lineup as the older ones start leaving.
Captain Marvel will be released BETWEEN Avengers 3.1 & 3.2, so that will be vital, especially if they stick her with the Guardians, which seems a likely way to power her up without complicating the story with Mar-Vell. Her story will probably be the impetus that teams up the Avengers and Guardians, and then, whoever survives the movie(sorry Steve) will be the ones who the next phase is designed around.
I suspect that the way Marvel is playing around with character identities in the comics is sort of a test-run for passing on identities to other actors. If anyone worthy could be Captain America, then sure, why not Bucky or Sam Wilson acting as Captain America in the movies? Or even someone else entirely?
That can work with Cap and Thor, but Tony IS Tony.
@40: People felt the same way about Connery as Bond, William Hartnell as the Doctor, Leonard Nimoy as Spock, etc. We never believe another actor can take over an iconic role… until the first time it happens.
One possibility I’ve heard suggested is a hybrid of the two approaches — have Tony or Steve or whoever “die” for a couple of movies and get replaced by a sidekick, and then bring them back with a new actor in the role after enough time has passed to cushion the transition. Maybe explain it away with plastic surgery or Infinity Formula rejuvenation or something.
@41, You’re misreading me. I’m not saying that another actor can’t play Tony, I’m saying that Captain America and Thor are iconic heroes, seperate from their individual persons, and Tony is not.
You can continue Cap & Thor’s stories by having another hero take up their mantle. Only Tony Stark can be Tony Stark.
I agree that the path Marvel looks like it is trying to take is the one you are talking about, avoiding having to recast, right now.
The MCU is being set up for Bucky or Sam to take up the shield, the scene with the hammer hints at the whole “worthy” thing for Thor’s replacement. Then, in Phase 6, Steve Rogers can be “resurrected” being played by a different actor, when Evans performance isn’t so fresh.
No groundwork has been laid in regards to Tony, that I can tell. No other member of the MCU is being groomed to take Tony’s place, is what I’m saying, not that another actor couldn’t take RDJs place.
@42: That doesn’t follow. Iron Man and Captain America are titles, so they can naturally be passed on to another person. But Thor isn’t a title like Superman or Wonder Woman, it’s just the guy’s first name. Granted, in the comics at least two other men — and one woman, currently — have taken on the name Thor while Mr. Odinson was otherwise occupied or dead, but it’s harder to justify them using the name than it is to justify Jim Rhodes being Iron Man, Bucky Barnes or Sam Wilson being Captain America, Miles Morales being Spider-Man, Wally West being the Flash, Tim Drake being Robin, etc.
In the comics, Rhodey was Iron Man for some time while Tony was recovering from alcoholism; he didn’t become War Machine until Tony reclaimed the Iron Man title. So I disagree that no other character is in position to replace Tony. Rhodey is in that position simply by being Rhodey.
Although maybe we’re talking about two different things. Maybe you’re not talking about Iron Man so much as the role that Tony plays out of costume, as the anchor and organizer of the superhero community. But if anything, in the comics that’s more traditionally been Captain America’s role.
Robert Downey Jr. and Marvel have basically made each other at this point. Whenever he departs from the role, it’s not going to be the same. Ultimately he has had a lot of say over the direction of the entire line and from what I’ve heard he has boosted and supported his fellow actors (except Terrence Howard, I dunno what happened there) in their negotiations with Marvel.
So even if someone else is in the Iron Man suit, if RDJ is gone it’s going to be a different experience. But they’re not going to stop until the movies stop making money.
I think Hemsworth/Thor will actually be incredibly difficult to replace. That said, I’m not sure he’s as ready to move on as RDJ or Chris Evans? (Both of whom I’m sure would love to still be involved, but on a less aggressive schedule.)
I think as long as the actors are around, there’s a good chance they might be resurrected/come out of retirement/whatever, and they won’t get recast, but they might pass on their mantles – at least for a time.
@43, It doesn’t follow for you. It makes perfect sense to me.
I know Iron Man is a title, but I’m not talking about the person who wears the suit, I’m talking about TONY. They aren’t really establishing who can take Tony’s place.
I know Thor is his name, but I’m talking about the “Wielder of Mjolnir” which doesn’t have to be a big surfer dude, it can be anyone who is worthy, which the next movie is establishing.
@46: Yes, but I’m trying to understand what it is that you define as “Tony’s place” and what you think is unique about it. If it’s not “the guy in the Iron Man suit” and it’s not “the leader of the hero community,” then what specifically is it?
The Avengers have always had a very fluid lineup in the comics. I would not be surprised to see a different lineup of heros in every Avengers movie. Cap, Iron Man and Thor have often not been a part of the lineup. So even if the actors go, and are not recast, the team can live on.
And I hate the idea of a reboot. I dislike reboots, especially when they come so close on the heels of the original movies. The fact that the new Spiderman movies came so close to the last trilogy just ruined it for me. And one thing we need less of in future comic-based movies is more origin stories. Give us a few glimpses of backstory during the credits, but then just get into the action. Trust me, the audiences can keep up!
I was really excited to see Boseman cast as Panther–he is a great actor.
And I am excited by the Captain Marvel news–I am hoping it is the DeConnick version that hits the big screen, as the current incarnation of Captain Marvel is my favorite.
Lots of good news today!
@48: Well, the DeConnick version of Carol is the only one that’s called Captain Marvel rather than Ms. Marvel (or Binary or Warbird), so presumably that’s what they’re going for.
@47, The science guy, the snark guy, the catalyst guy, the “uh oh what did I do” guy, Tony fills a lot of holes that I don’t think anyone character in particular can fill.
@50: Bruce Banner is also the science guy, as is Hank Pym, whom Michael Douglas is playing in the upcoming Ant-Man. So, for that matter, is T’Challa (Black Panther). Marvel is full of science-genius superheroes. (There’s even talk of Marvel getting the rights to Spider-Man, who’s both a science guy and a snark guy.) Star Lord is a snark guy, and so is practically everyone in a Joss Whedon script. Several characters have been catalysts, most of all Fury and Loki. Why does there have to be one character who does all those things? The MCU has grown to the point that it isn’t dependent on any single character anymore. I think that will be the key to its longevity. It will change, and some will miss the parts that go away, but change is what permits something to endure.
@51, I’m calling Fury’s gonna die in AoU, StarLord is in another series, I agree about the science people, and Loki’s time as a catalyst for the Avengers is over, IMO.
You are making my point. They will only be able to fill the whole Tony leaves, with multiple people.
@52: Star Lord is currently separate from the rest of the MCU, but the Guardians are probably going to converge with the Earthbound MCU once we get into Infinity War. And Loki isn’t going anywhere.
@53, Yes, the Avengers and Guardians will team up(while Tony’s still around) I’m talking about beyond Phase 3.
Loki isn’t going anywhere, but he can’t fill the same role, if the dynamic doesn’t change, the story is stale.