If you’re a Dungeons & Dragons fan, then you may already be aware that the next edition of D&D is swooping in at the end of the summer, courtesy of publisher Wizards of the Coast. Whether you’re up on the latest rules, a cantankerous old grognard, or simply a proponent of the oft-exemplary offshoots, this is still a momentous time for the game and could either reignite or diminish the famous brand. Likely it will do a little bit of both—you cannot please everyone—but my personal hope is that it attracts a wealth of new players to the hobby: kids, teens, adults, whomever! After the “edition wars” and other rules-based schisms that online fans still like to argue about, it remains to be seen whether this iteration of Earth’s original and most iconic role-playing game takes wing.
Since announcing its inception in 2012—controversially only four years after the 4th Edition release—Wizards of the Coast has been calling this new one “D&D Next.” Finally, finally, they seem to have dropped the marketspeak “Next” and are just calling it what it is. But let’s be clear, it is the Fifth Edition of the game. D&D has featured a long, storied, and meandering set of rules since its early days and this latest one can only subjectively be considered the best. They began with the original basic set in 1974, and other “OD&D” books, before the creation of Advanced Dungeons & Dragons (aka what we now call 1st Edition). Honestly, it helps to think of everything prior to 1977 as the dungeon or foundation—or at least the nostalgic mezzanine—of the D&D tower. Now we’re on the fifth floor and it looks pretty sweet (and squamous) up here, whatever you might think of what lies beneath.
As is tradition, the new edition will launch with three core rulebooks in an asynchronous, claw/claw/bite pattern: The Player’s Handbook (PHB) releases in August, followed by the Monster Manual (MM) in September and the Dungeon Master’s Guide (DMG) in November. For newbies, know this: These are the only books you’d need to play the game—which is good, considering they’re $50 each! Yes, there will also come a flurry of ready-made adventures (the Tyranny of Dragons storyline in August–October) and even a Starter Set Box (July) for those who can’t wait. But to play Dungeons & Dragons you need only the basic rules and your imagination. Oh, and some friends, dice, and table space. (Doritos and Mountain Dew are optional—and frankly overrated.)
Meanwhile, scope out the monstrous new covers! I’m not yet sure how to feel about them for what they represent—I’m a longtime fan and there’s a lot of cover nostalgia to overcome—but there’s no denying their visual appeal. A fire giant dominates the PHB, a beholder draws the eye(s) on the MM, and a lich overshadows the DMG. On each, adventurers representing your characters contend with a classic D&D villain.
One thing two of these covers have in common is their joint origins on the canvas of artist and Spectrum Fantastic Art Gold Winner Tyler Jacobson. Let’s start with King Snurre—the titular monarch of the 1978’s The Hall of the Fire Giant King adventure module—who looms on the cover of the Player’s Handbook.
I asked Jacobson himself if he could describe the scene. It looks like a human and an elf (or half-elf) are taking on King Snurre.
Jacobson: The scene does depict a battle where two heroes are maneuvering to take on the King. The angle is so extreme in order to convey a desperate battle again such a giant foe. I wanted to put the female hero in a pose that seemed very “last ditch effort” to cast a spell and possibly take him out, but as a consequence she would probably fall to the ground on her back and be left very vulnerable. But mainly I just wanted a composition that was very action-packed and all the poses helped that nicely.
I was extremely satisfied to see the Player’s Handbook’s cover at last give us an action heroine in sensible clothing—quite a contrast to last edition’s PHB cover. Whatever anyone thinks of the overall format and design of these books, that’s a huge win. I asked Tyler where he intended to draw the viewer’s eye in this one.
Jacobson: I used the brightest point in the image as my intended focus, which would be the magic about to be cast in the female hero’s hand. The blue magic contrasts the hot colors everywhere else in the image. It is also where most of the detail meets (the giant’s face and the hero’s face)
Okay, D&D players: what spell is she casting? And as for old Snurre’s togs, what’s in fashion these days in the firelit, obsidian halls of the Fire Giant King?
Jacobson: The King is wearing a white dragon hide, wrapped around his torso and resting over his back portions with the wings hanging off the side. Large chunks of scales are also being used as shoulder are on his right side (our left). The skull of the dragon is the helmet with red jewels in place of the eyes.
That’s one unfortunate, but esteemed white wyrm!
Meanwhile, the Dungeon Master’s Guide depicts the lich Acererak, undead archvillain and primary adversary from 1975’s the infamous Tomb of Horrors adventure module.
Jacobson: The main thought was that he was in control. Being the DMG, we wanted to convey a sense of the players being in real trouble. The lich is extremely powerful and we wanted the DMs out there to get excited about wielding that power. From my angle, I wanted the lich to be looming over the viewer and seem unstoppable as he raised the corpses around him. Heroes that just fell in an attempt to destroy him are now working for him. Very demoralizing.
DMs as demoralizors…how delightfully ironic. There’s no doubt that Tyler Jacobson is invoking great evil and great power here. Where the PHB cover heroine potentially has the drop on the fire giant, Acererak here is clearly winning.
Tyler’s own blog gives us a closer look at this momentous project and the art itself. Finally, I asked him how he felt about being chosen to illustrate the covers of these two books.
Jacobson: I am extremely honored. When I was first asked, I couldn’t say yes fast enough. I mean it was the CORE books!! It was a once in a lifetime opportunity. I hope they have a good impact and get people excited about the game. If they can do that, then I have done my job.
The opinions are certainly going to run the spectrum, but I think most agree they’re exciting to look at and make one eager to roll up a character—or step behind the DM’s screen and throw down some monsters. I am certainly of the latter.
In some ways, this new edition of D&D is an attempted reboot, a gamble to win back many of the fans turned off by the jarring gear-changing of 4th Edition’s rules, or even the 3rd. Even now, the D&D fan base is a mixed bag of the eager, the wary, and the still-simmering. The use of iconic Greyhawk monsters on these covers is at least a nod to the Old Guard of the D&D community. And honestly, it’s exciting to see our favorite old game become new again.
Still, one thing is different this time around. Wizards of the Coast has released a series of free-to-download public playtest rules over the course of a year and a half, actively soliciting feedback from the community. The rules have evolved plenty since the start of that open playtest, for better and for worse. (For example, at one point, dwarves were completely immune to poison—crazy, right?—and now they’re back to just having “advantage” against it. Advantage/disadvantage being a simple, but fun new mechanic that involves rolling a d20 twice and using the better/worse result.) The final result may be an exquisite corpse, or it could be the hybrid we’ve been looking for.
Having dabbled with every update of the playtest rules in my own D&D Eberron campaign, it’s my opinion that this new edition, at first glance, does indeed feel like a bit of an amalgam of all previous editions. And that’s a good thing. 5th Edition has the initial nostalgic sensibility of 1st and 2nd Editions (but without the crazy charts), the essential look and ease of 3rd Edition (but without the complexity—I’m looking at you, grapple rules!), and it has some of the tactical awareness of 4th Edition (but without the normalizing math and video game feel). I was even fortunate enough, as a freelance writer for Wizards of the Coast, to be included in the more exclusive Friends and Family Playtest group, so I’ve had a closer look at what’s to come. Will it work for everyone? Not a chance. Will it be fun for many? Absolutely. But then, it’s not out yet.
Personally, I’m just glad that kids introduced to D&D for the first time starting this summer won’t have to start with the glut of 4th Edition mechanics. The rules are more streamlined for faster gameplay, while some of the complexities and character builds that some gamers want are presented as optional rules. For the most part, there seems to be a greater emphasis on—I should say return to—story, and as a writer that’s precisely where my love of the game has always been.
The world of non-digital games—board, card, tabletop, role-playing—is in a kind of renaissance now. Let’s hold onto it! In this digital age of increasingly immersive yet imagination-limiting video and computer RPGs, now would be an excellent time for pen-and-paper, sitting-around-a-table-with-other-humans activities to thrive again. And if you’re not into Wizards of the Coast’s rebranding, rebooting, and reselling? Go back and pick up some of the old stuff from your basement, your parents’ storage, or online. It’s all still good.
So, for that matter, is Paizo’s Pathfinder system, or Goodman Games’s Dungeon Crawl Classics RPG, or Autarch’s Adventurer Conqueror King System.
Dungeons & Dragons by any other name would smell as sweet and still breath fire. And acid, poison, lightning, and frost.
Jeff LaSala is a writer and gamer who’s still geeked that Tyler Jacobson illustrated one of his articles once. He’s written for D&D Insider, penned an Eberron novel, and made sure his newborn son knew that dragons are friends.
I stopped here:
“These are the only books you’d need to play the game—which is good, considering they’re $50 each!”
Really????
In a day and age when kids have the internet and can, for about $50, actually see all the stuff that D&D let me imagine when I was a kid, what kid is going to pay $150 to imagine stuff?
I sold my books long ago, but I read the article thinking it might be fun to see how it has evolved. But no way am I forking over $150 for an old-fashioned role-playing game.
Time marches on. In a world where comic books cost upwards of $5-6 a piece these prices really aren’t that big of a deal. It’s 2014…not the 1980s anymore.
Help an old(ish) gamer out: When did they drop the “Advanced” from Advanced Dungeons & Dragons? I haven’t played since the 1st Edition (and what’s “Wizards of the Coast?” Don’t they make Magic Cards?) so much/all of this is brand new to me.
@@@@@#3
Wizards of the Coast did indeed make the Magic: The Gathering CCG. With the immense profit they bought TSR back in the mid- to late-1990s and folded all of the D&D stuff into WoC (including the once great Amazing Stories magazine, which under their care became little more than a series of ads held together by a mediocre story or two).
As for the price of the new materials, I don’t care that comic books might be $5.00; $50.00 buys me a halfway decent digital game (most of the time). It’s far too steep for the individual books and $150.00 for all three (which is really what you are going to be spending) is cost prohibitive. Add in map tiles, miniuatures (which I never really saw the point of in a pencil and paper game), and other assorted costs (Doritos are never over-rated), and you’re looking at a chunk of change to get started.
D&D hasn’t really been the same since WoC bought TSR anyway, so I don’t really have any desire to own or play 5th Edition. I’ll stick with my original AD&D books, thanks.
I came for the Tiamat artwork ;)
I know some people love it, and more power to ’em, but the one thing 4e taught me me was that there were other games out there besides D&D. I’ve been playing Pathfinder, Mutants and Masterminds, a little bit of Vampire the Masquerade, Mage the Ascension, Kult, and even some Alternity in the years since it came out. I have to agree with Jim, I won’t be shelling out $150 for these, either. Hopefully, I’ll be missing out on something awesome, I’d love to be wrong about it.
Jim Burnell: $150 is what? Less than 3 new video games? About 7 months of WoW subscription? 10 movies seen in the theater? And honestly, with inflation $50 per book is on par with the $20 per book of 2nd edition.
$150 is a reasonable these days considering what everything else costs and the number of hours of enjoyment people get out of these books. If I went to the theater and watched a movie every Friday with my friends, I’d spend a lot more than $150 over the five years of weekly playing I’ve had with my group.
Besides, the $150 is if you want to run games. If you just want to play, $50 is what most people will pay, if not just share books among the group.
“And honestly, with inflation $50 per book is on par with the $20 per book of 2nd edition.” Really? Other than (sadly) gasoline, what products do you buy today that cost 2.5 times as much as they cost in the 1990s?
As I recall when I was a kid, a typical mass-market paperback novel cost about $5, and each of the AD&D manuals was about $15-$20.
http://www.slj.com/2013/06/research/sljs-average-book-prices-2013/#_ says that, in 2013, the average mass-market paperback novel costs about $8, an increase of about 30%.
So I’d expect each manual today to cost about $30-$35 max.
I realize that this isn’t the 1980s, but role-playing games are not exactly as hot as they were in the 1980s either. If Wizards of the Coast wants to encourage new young blood, asking $150 for the 3 manuals
necessary to play the game is not a good idea.
The article doesn’t mention it, but the traditional three books will follow the release of a starter version enabling play for the first few character levels for $20, which is presumably what Wizards will be using to try to hook less well-heeled players and reel them in.
Mind, $50 for a 300-page full-sized, full-color hardback is fairly realistic for publishing these days. It’s not on the cheap end of print RPGs, but it’s not jaw-droppingly high, either. One hopes that there will be a less pricey digital option available, although Wizards has historically been shaky about offering digital versions of their products.
Jim, what you are not taking into consideration is the materials. A lot of the newer books are hard backed, quality paper and color. Those $15-$20 books, were soft cover, and if there was a color picture it was only on the first page. The rest was B&W. Note: My 2nd ed book says $30, was hard cover and was B&W.
At the same time, I’m not shilling out any money until I see it’s a good system. I’ve been playing pathfinder and I can get the corebook for $10 digitially.. I do think they are making a mistake on the costs.
TheJonesest: I believe maybe the Advanced was dropped when 3rd Edition came out.
Garyfury: Yup, I mentioned the Starter Set box, but I didn’t want to go into the other products as much, since the core books are, again, the heart of the game.
Plugging the cover prices for the AD&D 2nd edition PHB ($25.00 in 1995) into the Bureau of Labor Statistics inflation calculator came up with $38.89. The $29.95 cover price for a 3.5 PHB (2003) kicked back at $38.59. Given the increased production costs and Hasbro’s (owner of Wizards of the Coast) profit demands it isn’t hard to see a $50 retail price point.
That said I think I’ll wait to see if the three book collection comes out at a discount around the holidays. It will be good to see some actual play reviews before shelling out to bring a new edition to my table, since I’ll be the poor fool running it. Meanwhile I’ll stick with Cartoon Action Hour and Savage Worlds.
Attracting new players will drive away the older ones, but we will always have 3.5 (or earlier if you prefer) and can pretend this shit doesn’t exist.
6. Troy Lenze
I always use the Beer System. People complain the movie is too expensive? Well, that movie is two or three hours long. That’s two or three beers…yep, the movie is more cost effective. Comparing the hours of use I’ll get out of these books to that scale makes them seem an incredible bargain.
I am leaning towards buying the starter set for my 11 yr old son. He had a sleepover birthday party a few months ago and I dragged out my 1st edition books to get a game going with his friends. They really loved it, even more than I imagined they would since I figured they would be too used to video and card-type games to be into it… Anyone know what is in the starter set?… I havent seen much about it yet. Good Art? I assume it includes a module of some sort? I think this might be a better way for him and his friends to get started. since its cheap and the core PH and DMG might be overwhelming to an 11 yr old.
We live in the world of Amazon.com. Few of us will pay straight up $50. WoC probably knows this and anticpates the markdown.
I’m looking forward to this new edition. My biggest frustration is that I bought all those 4E books just a few years ago! grrr
And not everyone needs all three books, anyway. The Player’s Guide for the PCs, and its’ the DM that needs the others.
JasonDenzel, you feel all our pain. I saw the merits of 4th Edition, played it a fair amount, and still like a lot of the books. But it’s how recent that was that makes this a tough pill to swallow. Also, I think you’re right about the price.
Neuralnet, I’m not sure anyone’s seen the content. But even 4th Edition had a beginniner box that was a decent intro to the game. Being 4th Edition was the only downside. It came with dice, a DMG-ish book with a walkthrough, almost choose-your-own-adventure type series of encounters, a PHB book that gave you the first couple of levels of several classes, some character and monster tokens, and a few map grids. A good deal for $20. I expect this new one to be more accessible.
Ehhh, I got stuck in AD&D 2nd Edition, thank you very much. d20 was a nice system, but regarding D&D I’m hopelessly old school.
Also, 2nd edition= rad settings like Planescape and Dark Sun.
$50 is in line with Pathfinder, which is the true hurdle D&D has to overcome. It is not completely crazy, particular if the books are well printed (e.g. do not fall out of their spine 2nd edition or smudge like 3rd edition).
The real craziness is the release schedule. The DM Guide in November? After the Monster Manual? Who thought that was a good idea?
I believe the staggered release for 3rd Edition was PHB (August), DMG (Sept), MM (Oct). Don’t recall what 4E’s was, but it was similar. I guess the new thing is presenting the MM last.
Another thing to consider: Unless you plan on being the Dungeon Master (you need only one for the group), you needn’t spend $150 (or whatever the markdown would be for Amazon-type purchases). You need only the Player’s Handbook if you’re going to just roll up a character and join the group—or hell, split the cost with someone. Who says everyone needs a copy? As a near-constant DM, I see no need for all my players to own the Monster Manual.
Walker@19: The first book released for AD&D (what we now call 1st edition) was the Monster Manual.
I started D&D with the old red box, pre first edition set, and didn’t update until 3E. To date, these are the only D&D sets for me. Though, I really do hope the 5E brings in new players. Every generation deserves their own D&D.
Good thing for Gen Con. pay 6-8 bucks, get a play through of a 5th edition adventure and see what is what from the source itself. I imagine that the book will be realeased either just prior or during the event (off the top of my head the weekend of August 11th?). It must be available there for purchase. I wouldn’t doubt someone from my gaming group picking up a copy just to tinker with our house rules in our current games.
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At that time, if I’m not mistaken, the game was released in a box (just like strategy games were). The first D&D book was the monster manual, but back then the creators of D&D hadn’t yet realized the best format for marketing RPGs (as books, as other publishing companies would do during the next years).
Gawd, D&D players are an ornery lot.
Wizards of the Coast still make Magic:TG. In fact, it’s just passed the 20 year milestone, which in CCG-years is around about Methuselah standard. And it still has a very large playerbase after reinventing the series about 8 years ago to be less intimidating to new and casual players.
My point is: they take the psychology of what makes a fun gaming experience very seriously and conscientiously, which isn’t the same thing as never making a mistake.
Perhaps D&D 5e won’t be for you. But I can pretty much guarantee it will make a lot of people happy.
@25: The Basic and Expert D&D sets were available boxed at the time, but the AD&D line was intended from the start to be released as three hardcovers: MM, PHB, and DMG, none of which were compatible with anything else that was out at the time. Dragon Magazine teased all three of them (and their release schedule) for a year or so before the MM was released.
Played some of the 5th edition playtest stuff, and found it more enjoyable than 4th edition which bogs down horribly in combat. Still worry how much that will reappear in the final edition. (The online statements out of WoC actually has me worried).
I’m not sure if the charm of AD&D though is really available anywhere, but that might be a statement of my age more than any game.
I play 4th ed, because my gaming group doesn’t want to restart and learn a different system. But from other RPG players it has always been “why aren’t you playing Pathfinder????” That is really who WoC has to beat with 5th ed. otherwise they will just be the Magic:TG people.
Even better: there’s a new edition of Tunnels & Trolls coming out, and that won’t cost an arm and a leg. (And it’s full of Trollish fun.)
As of yesterday the Amazon price was at $40 and free shipping. I started with AD&D but played using the PHB of the 2nd addition when it came out, and a bit of third since my DM incorporated it into are sessions along with his own stuff. I never needed anything but the PHB since I don’t want to run a game just play. I’ll still wait until Xmas for the 5e PHB unless the mark down is bigger sooner. I can use the $50 to splurge on things like the phone bill until then. Iam looking forward to checking out the new rules I just need to find a game .
I’m an old time AD&D gamer, but I’ve played using the D&D 5th Edition rules and found them better than the 4th Edition. It does take a little getting used to–any change does–but the game play seems more fluid with the new rules. Losing my Warlord character kinds sucked, but hey, you get used to that stuff, too. :)
Good article, Mr. LaSala.
As far as the price goes, I find that like video games, once a book has gone a month or so past it’s release date, you can get it cheaper online if you look hard enough. The Book Depository are especially good for this
http://www.bookdepository.com/search/advanced?noResults=true
and my friend saved a tonne of cash when he got the new Star Wars system from these guys (around £7-£10 a book). Cant see them on there yet, but you can be sure they will appear.
On price, Pathfinder and some other games offer pdfs at discounted rates. So the Pathfinder core rulebook is $50 but the pdf is $10. I just looked up Fantasy Flight’s Dark Heresy and their core rulebook is $60 and a pdf is $30. It sounds like WotC should do the same if they want to compete. The 5th edition might be worth trying out but not at $150 dollars.
AD&D was expensive when it came out, and $50 is probably less when adjusted for inflation (as others have pointed out already). I had to wait and scrimp and save to get the originals.
My issue with 4th Ed. wasn’t that I am a hater hating anything new; it was that the previous editions were improvements of the preceding set (even 1st/ AD&D improved and consolidated the OD&D booklets), not a totally new Extreme!D&D. Ackthpht!
(2nd Ed. was a mixed success, yes, but still….)
The covers give me hope that they are at least aware of the good stuff.
I’m very excited to see the next iteration of the D&D game. The $50 price tag doesn’t scare me in the least. I know I’m likely to enjoy these books for years to come. As a parent I know kids these days have access to far more resources then I ever did. Both my kids wanted Ipods I refused to buy them. I made them save their own money to purchase what they wanted. So the kids that really want to own 5th edition will.
Unlike many others I actually liked what 4th edition Dungeons and Dragons brought to the table.
Heck all those folks that went flocking to Pathfinder after abonding the SS D&D owe a lot of the improvements made to Pathfinder to 4th edition.
Also 4th brought in a lot of new blood into the hobby which is important. Personally I’m going to play D&D Next. Will it surpass Mutants and Masterminds as my favorite game? I don’t know. What I do know is I’ll continue to support the hobby with my dollars. Sometimes it’s a bust other times you hit a home run it’s just the nature of the beast.
Thanks for the look into future.
Well said, Nerdarchy.
Concerning the price of $50 per book. It has been stated by Mike Mearls of Wizards that you don’t need any other book than the PHB to make and run a full campaign.
Sounds like the Monster Manual will provide more monsters for use and DMG will be advice for DMing and optional rules modules, but the main rules for actually playing the game are all in the PHB. That’s why the DMG isn’t even out till November. It’s not essential. If you have a tight budget (and I do as well), just get the PHB and try it out from there. Then later see if you want/need the MM and DMG.
I’ve paid as much for Pathfinder after being let down with 4ed and the disownment of all previous editions to push something that was nothing more than Magic with some written rules. A system that tanked what was pure about the genre to compete with video games by making a system that felt dumbed down, static, and unimaginative. Bitter? a little. Many of us feel betrayed and let down by the company who went all in on one edition at the cost of all the others. Truth be told, if it weren’t for RA Salvatore still writting with WotC, I probably wouldn’t even give this any time. So do I abandon Paizo that listened to its base to jump back to one that now sees the error of their ways. I can’t see doing it. I think many others feel the same way. I could always change my mind but my mind would have to be blown by how awesome this edition is.
I’m surprised that nobody has taken a stab at the spell–if I had to guess, it would be an Ice Storm (average 20 damage/half if they make their dexterity save), just because ice is what you use against fire, right?
Of course the old standby of Polymorph is fun to use, too. Fire Giants aren’t that scary when you turn them into a Newt.
I don’t know, Egamma. Ice Storm is the sort of thing you cast from a distance…
Jeff, thanks for the tour. I am a lapsed gamer who started again recently with 4th edition. From what I’ve read online, I’m in the minority of people who liked the combat details in 4th, but it did take way too long with each player at the table deliberating their choices. I played most of Murder in Baldur’s Gate using the playtest rules. I found that the story moved along at a nice pace and combat didn’t bog things down. The playtest rules didn’t get in the way and seemed to offer a rich combat experience, much better for me than my early days with the game, and much faster than 4th. I’m hoping that the product will be successful enough that we see an array of optional add-ons to suit every gamer.
I will give 5th edition a go and will be buying the books, but with all of the choices out there, I have plenty of places to go if it doesn’t live up to its pedigree.
…And this just in:
Wizards of the Coast will be releasing a Basic Dungeons & Dragons PDF—as a free download from their website—that covers the core rules of the game. “It runs from levels 1 to 20 and covers the cleric, fighter, rogue, and wizard, presenting what we view as the essential subclass for each. It also provides the dwarf, elf, halfling, and human as race options.”
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20140527
That’s a pretty impressive move for WotC (and maybe very smart), allowing scads of people to get into D&D without having to pay a cent. Sure many of us will buy the books—some of us, all of them. But everyone needn’t to at least try it out.
WotC burned me really bad with 4th edition DnD. They used my love for DnD to get me to buy their super lame game which they passed off as DnD.
They took my money and broke my trust.
I don’t care how cool the art is…They will not get my money again!
You don’t NEED to buy anything to play DnD 5th edition the Basic ruleset is 100% FREE and will be online the day the starter pack releases. If you want to have more options, classes, races,etc then you buy the Player’s Handbook only. If you want to GM you might want the DMG and Monster Manual but they are not required either.
Maybe you should learn about the product before bashing it and making things up.
Who pays cover price for books anyway. Since you all clearly know of the Internet (otherwise you wouldn’t be posting here), I’m sure you would appreciate being educated on the advantages of shopping online, too. You see cover prices on books are meaningless here. We have a thing called Amazon.com, where you can get the Player’s Handbook for $29.97. As for the rest of the books, your DM is responsible for those, and he or she probably already knows about online shopping (they do tend to be a more intelligent, or at least thrifty (due to the collective cost of their chosen gaming role, bunch.
Now, can we stop whining about the cost and get excited about the game?
When I saw $50 for each book at 320 pages I was simply FLABERGASTED! I am an experienced graphic designer who has a lot of printing experience. I have priced printing costs for large and small print runs for catalogues, magazines and books throughout my professional career. I could see $50 for a 500-550 page book but not 320 pages. That’s highway robery plain and simple, despite online discounts. I’ve lost a lot of respect for Wizards of the Coast. I look at what Paizo has done since the release of Pathfinder and I simply can not suport Wizards of the Coast after their half-assed job with D&D!
Everyone who is venting their 4th edition angst needs to dial it back a bit. First of all, it’s been six years. Second, no matter how much you disliked the game, it is a game. It didn’t rape your sister, it was just a game that you didn’t enjoy. Finally, if you were actually such a die hard fan that this hyperbolic rage is warranted, then 4th edition would never have gotten your money. You see, for months before release, Wizards posted bidaily updates of what they were doing with the system on the website. Why did you buy the game if you didn’t like what you saw?
There’s nothing wrong with disliking 4th edition. Most of the complaints about it, I can agree with to some degree (I can also level equally valid complaints against every edition). However, buyers remorse over a hundred dollar purchase from half a decade ago is never an excuse for this level of betrayal speech.
That being said, while I do think the costs of the 5th ed corebooks are within acceptable peramiters, they aren’t what I’d like to have seen. Personally, I don’t think we need massive, hardcover full color corebooks. I was really hoping for a return to something more like the BECMI edition. With a moderately priced starter box (with folio style books) and having everything else plug into and build on that starter box (rather than having the starter box be a trimmed down version of the game which must basically be thrown out when you ‘graduate’ to the full game).
I also take some issue with the concept that ‘Nobody will pay cover price cause, internet.’ That logic would hold up if we could play D&D at Amazon. For those of us who support the actual stores and people in our community, we will be paying full price. If we don’t, our place to play these games and meet new local gamers goes away.
P.S. the Advanced was dropped with 3rd edtition on the logic that there was no ‘basic’ version of D&D in that edition for it to be advanced from. Basic D&D had been supported through most of 2nd edition in various forms.
P.P.S. The 4th edition books weren’t staggered. They all dropped on the same day along with the slipcase collection.
$50.00 per book. I’ll stick with Pathfinder. A couple bucks cheaper and it is the continuation of the most popular of D&D’s systems. Besides the new Advanced Class guide comes out soon. I may download these on a torrent but as for shelling out $150 for the BASIC NECESSITIES to play the game. F’ that.
I’d like to reiterate the last three paragraphs of my article. :)
For me, I guess it comes down to nostalgia and familiarity with what edition you get introduced to playing this game. I started playing back when 2nd Ed. came out and currently run a campaign based on the Advanced 2nd Ed. with the Expanded rules books. After hearing all the complaints that came with later editions, I felt good about sticking with what I already knew and had in my library.
I will admit I am curious to see how long-time fans of the game will receive the 5 Edition. I hope it’s a rousing success and helps bring back gamers who became disenchanted with the D&D brand. Should it become a huge hit, I may even consider converting to the new edition but I will take a wait and see approach.
Concerning the price of the books, yeah $150 is a chunk of money to spend, however I believe any hobby that you intend on investing a lot of time and energy into usually requires a financial investment at the start. I guess it all boils down to the level of commitment you make to the game and how long you want to play it to justify paying that price.
I find it strange that no one, after JLaSala’s original mention of it, is much mentioning the Basic version of this being completely free and offering play for up to level 20. This is beyond a great deal! As I’ve probably always been more of a Basic D&D fan, this gives me a full game for free and I will be able to run through modules with nothing but it. Great deal!
Just thought I’d mention that Amazon is currently listing the basic box set for 5th Ed. for $13 which will be released July 15th. In addition, they’ve discounted the other core rule books/manuals down from the $50 asking price to $30 on average.
Again, just thought I’d share this with whoever reads this in case any interested parties are thinking of trying the new edition out.
Thanks, GrandMaster Jay. And for your more optimistic view, the green death. Also, some gaming stores will have the Starter set this Thursday, the 3rd. Might be worth calling one….
And here we are, the freebie “basic” rules: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/Article.aspx?x=dnd%2Fbasicrules
Recently downloaded the basic rules .pdf @@@@@ the request of my former 4e DM. Looks kind of interesting actually.
Do think the ability score adjustments need a little tweaking, however.
Kato
i only have one complaint with the free rule set, while its literaly one thing, its a huge issue, they didnt put anything about feats! they just said they exist, they are important, and you get none of them because they forgot to put even a small list of them in this book o.o im highly confused by this
I’m not crazy about the way feats are handled now (as an alternative to boosting ability scores every few levels), but I’m glad they’re not as likely to get as out of control as they have been in past editions. They’re meant to be a varient, optional rule now, which is why I guess they’ve been relegated elsewhere. Keep in mind that we’re only seeing the Basic Rules, and the and the slimmed down the Starter Set ruleset. More will come in the Player’s Handbook, etc.
Regarding the price, look at Amazon. As of right now, they have the following prices:
(1) Starter Kit: $13
(2) PHB: $30
(3) DM & MM: $35
Of course the Starter Kit is not required…but is the first to come out. So, for $100 you can preorder the whole set, which is basically buy 2 get 1 free!
50$ might sound steep, but considering it’s a hardcover book, with collector value, and FULL COLOR illistrations it’s not that outside the box. That’s 150$ for ALL of you and your buddies to be able to play. 4-5 people can use these books….. AS A PLAYER you only REALLY need the 50$ PHB, a DM would WANT a MM but only NEEDS the DMG.
This is a game about using your imagination, so looks like you better get started if you can’t handle a fairly reasonable price.
I’m not going to rag on Wizards about the cost of the 3 books. If they deliver a new ruleset that is great, I’ll be using the books for 3 or 4 years. 4th Edition almost killed (made us all lose interest) the group I’ve been playing with the last 10 years – we went back to 3.5. Personally, I hope 5.0 looks more like a smart extension of 3.5. If it doesn’t, we’ll take what we like from 5.0 and copy/paste it into 3.5 (minus 3.5 grapple :)
well, I remember when…blah blah blah…Greyhawk…harumph…Gary Gygax rolling in his grave…
Hey folks, I played DnD since way back when just like you. I’m getting this set to play with my kids. The new rules look fantastic, streamlined and fun to play. All books are ordered, I’m already using the basic set.
Thanks, WoTC!
Back in 89 I bought the players handbook 2nd Ed for 30 bucks or something(AUD). I used that sucker for like 10-12 years. I had countless hours of entertainment. Its not like you use the books just for 1-3 weeks/months like video games. Seriously!? But yes, the books are expensive, and you have to really like it before you make the investment.
No one I knew went out and bought D&D to see what it is, it was always introduced by someone else.
I don’t think the $50 per book price is accurate. Amazon.com currently has them each listed between around $28-$38
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I am willing to pay 150 dollars to play a game that uses tons of imagination and ideas and craziness. The possibilties in DnD are endless. Much better than paying 50 bucks per new video game.
I’m going to be introducing my middle children to the game very soon. I am going to check out 5th edition just for the heck of it. If it is decent, I’ll play run it for them. It would be nice to be able to share D&D with them, but for it to be their D&D, not just a rehashing of mine. I agree that the cost for the books is prohibitive, but so is just about everything else these days. I will be getting the digital edition as that is about all I can afford these days.
I’ve been playing a few introductory stories with my old friends and we are loving this edition.
Our group began playing D&D 3.0, then 3.5. To us the game feels like a great improvement from 3.5.
None of us liked the 4th edition system, so we didn’t play more than one adventure, and we didn’t buy any books from Wizards.
So far we are so happy with 5th edition we are looking foward to see what else can Wizards publish in the coming years.